IDN Naysayers - DNForum - Domain Sales, Domain Forum, Domain Appraisals, Domain Registrars

**Rubber Duck** · 03-26-2005, 04:56 PM

It would seem that the final piece in the IDN story, is about to be put in place. The mechanism for the implementation of first level IDN is at an advanced stage of discussion at IETF. Please vistit:

http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/...idn-tld-04.txt

This in conjunction with the announcement of an IDN enabled IE7.0 and Sedo's imminent introduction of support for Chinese and Japanese IDN, together with local advertising for PPC parking suggests, that SEDO's assertion of an IDN explosion in the far east is just the beginning of the story. Please visit the posting below:

http://www.dnforum.com/sedo-com/79465-can-sedo-handle-idns-print.html

Regards
Dave Wrixon

**ctc** · 03-26-2005, 10:16 PM

**namewaiter** · 03-27-2005, 09:46 AM

in my opinion idns are a just a gimmick and waste of money. they will never be fully accepted and no major business would ever rely on an idn for it's online identity ... how would an idn ever be marketed? go get yourself a new keyboard, or hold the control/function 3 keys and type XXX to visit our website.

**Rubber Duck** · 03-27-2005, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by namewaiter

in my opinion idns are a just a gimmick and waste of money. they will never be fully accepted and no major business would ever rely on an idn for it's online identity ... how would an idn ever be marketed? go get yourself a new keyboard, or hold the control/function 3 keys and type XXX to visit our website.

Your comments simply serve to demonstrate you have utterly missed the point!

It should be noted that whilst it is difficult to get stats there are certainly already more IDNs out there than dot US or dot Biz.

Regards
Dave Wrixon

**namewaiter** · 03-27-2005, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwrixon

It should be noted that whilst it is difficult to get stats there are certainly already more IDNs out there than dot US or dot Biz.

Regards
Dave Wrixon

well of course there is more, take for example all the variations of 'business'...

please consider i don't have special character keys on my pc...

b^siness.com
b&siness.com
b*siness.com
b#siness.com
b%siness.com
b!siness.com

bu^iness.com
bu&iness.com
bu*iness.com
bu#iness.com
bu%iness.com
bu!iness.com

and so on and so on...

and then multiple this by all the different languages and the one word becomes thousands ... and people who registers one think they have a very unique domain, but the fact is all these variations only muddy the internet tenfold. if you hold a single character idn domain ... i do think that these have some value, but it so limited because of access issues. to be honest, i really don't have a true understanding of idns, i just see what people are trying to sell, get appraised, but i have no intentions of registering one or buying one for the reasons i stated.

good luck if you hold a few, domaining is truely a speculative industry.

and btw.. thanks for the link, there is some good info there.

**Rubber Duck** · 03-27-2005, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by namewaiter

well of course there is more, take for example all the variations of 'business'...

please consider i don't have special character keys on my pc...

b^siness.com
b&siness.com
b*siness.com
b#siness.com
b%siness.com
b!siness.com

bu^iness.com
bu&iness.com
bu*iness.com
bu#iness.com
bu%iness.com
bu!iness.com

and so on and so on...

and then multiple this by all the different languages and the one word becomes thousands ... and people who registers one think they have a very unique domain, but the fact is all these variations only muddy the internet tenfold. if you hold a single character idn domain ... i do think that these have some value, but it so limited because of access issues. to be honest, i really don't have a true understanding of idns, i just see what people are trying to sell, get appraised, but i have no intentions of registering one or buying one for the reasons i stated.

good luck if you hold a few, domaining is truely a speculative industry.

and btw.. thanks for the link, there is some good info there.

Yes, I share your perspective on these type of domains you have listed and they should probably legislated against.

I personally only invest in genuine Chinese, Japanese, Russian, Hindi and Arabic Domains and yes I do hold hundreds of single character domains including most of the Arabic Alphabet as dot coms. Japanese Hirigana characters are also going to be huge. Some of ours throw up over a Billion pages on a Google search. Actually, I do have a single novelty domain, which is dot com in a Playing Card Diamond. Have had approaches on that one but the $1000 asking was too high.

The point is you need a character match with search keywords. Chinese and Japanese people search in their own language and you need to be able to match the characters typed-in.

Yes, it is difficult to access if you don't have a local keyboard. The speculator has to improvise, but chinese and japanese users will just use their normal equipment. That is the whole point. I personally have to cut and paste to get these characters, as I only have the same keyboard as you do!

I don't think abuse of IDNs will be so great once they pass into areas for which they have been designed. Clearly homographic imitation has no legitimate value. The problem is as soon as you have a good innovation there are always of queue of conmen trying to exploit it!

The only recent clear cut stats I have on IDN is for the dot de registry, which is now about 260K. These will be largely genuine registrations. Whilst non-accented characters can be used by humans, it is unlikely that accented search words will be able to mapped to non-accented domains. The German IDNs are therefore more important than is immediately obvious. The real market, however, will always be Asia.

Obviously, mispellings do attract traffic, but the domains listed above are unlikely to get much, aren't worth anything and will soon be left to expire!

If you want to get more information on IDN, there is a basic guide available at www.chinesedomains.info.

Regards
Dave Wrixon

**mark** · 03-27-2005, 01:45 PM

thanks for the info dave. i recently registered www.idnenabled.com and it's starting to see a small amount of traffic and a few click thrus. the future of idn's, as a part of domain history, should be interesting no matter how they develop or not.

**dtobias** · 03-28-2005, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by namewaiter

in my opinion idns are a just a gimmick and waste of money. they will never be fully accepted and no major business would ever rely on an idn for it's online identity ... how would an idn ever be marketed? go get yourself a new keyboard, or hold the control/function 3 keys and type XXX to visit our website.

Well, obviously, the intended audience such sites would be marketed towards would be people who use a language with "special" characters in it, and who know how to type those characters (and perhaps have computers configured so that they are an easy keypress on their keyboards).

Prosperous · 03-28-2005, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mark

i recently registered www.idnenabled.com

Crap, that name was on my list to be registered!! :veryangry :-D

**mark** · 03-28-2005, 05:36 PM

lol. i actually got my inspiration from the domainsite.com main page. saw the word, figured it was already registered, checked it anyways and was surprised to see that it wasn't. go figure.....

Prosperous · 03-28-2005, 08:17 PM

lol, that's great, that's exactly where I came acroos the phrase, too!

Best of luck with it!

Rob

**Bramiozo** · 03-30-2005, 05:19 AM

Quote:

edo's imminent introduction of support for Chinese and Japanese IDN,..

Did you get this info from a direct source ?

**Rubber Duck** · 03-30-2005, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bramiozo

Did you get this info from a direct source ?

Horses Mouth!

**Bramiozo** · 03-30-2005, 05:45 AM

that's errr..pretty direct :=) .

**Acro** · 03-30-2005, 07:25 AM

IDN is the upcoming source of many online fraud: websites with international characters emulating legitimate websites, hijack attempts to transfer domains to IDN-generated accounts, the list is endless. Pure and simple, a fad that divides the Internet. IDN's are not even indexed by the major search engines. It must be fun living in communist China.

**Rubber Duck** · 03-30-2005, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RADiSTAR

IDN is the upcoming source of many online fraud: websites with international characters emulating legitimate websites, hijack attempts to transfer domains to IDN-generated accounts, the list is endless. Pure and simple, a fad that divides the Internet. IDN's are not even indexed by the major search engines. It must be fun living in communist China.

This is the least informed comment I have seen in a while.

I have a Russian IDN with over 30K Overture Keyword searches a month.

I have large numbers of Japanese, Chinese and Arabic Domains wih high Overture Keyword searches.

Nearly all our IDNs are producing significant traffic, which we have used to decide which ones to renew. Renewal rate is in first year is about 85% and would expect that to be at least 95% in our second year.

The world is divided by languages, but the internet and particularly IDN is a means of uniting it. If it is a FAD then a large number of very talented individuals have wasted the best years of their lives bringing it into being.

Microsoft are about to bring out an IDN version of their browser. Google are developing the pay per click market for advertising in the local languages. Sedo is about to launch Parking and targeted PPC for Asian IDN.

I could go on, but frankly your contribution does not warrant the effort I have already made on this reply.

Regards
Dave Wrixon

**ForumDomains** · 03-30-2005, 03:32 PM

Good answer Dave. I fully agree with you. Naysayers are just people that are afraid their "canonical" names will devalue when IDNs come into play or they just do not understand what it is all about! Because of their ignorance they just blame communism in China! LOL

**Rubber Duck** · 03-30-2005, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForumDomains

Good answer Dave. I fully agree with you. Naysayers are just people that are afraid their "canonical" names will devalue when IDNs come into play or they just do not understand what it is all about! Because of their ignorance they just blame communism in China! LOL

Yes, the derision is even more laughable when it comes from someone who is selling list of unregistered dot INs to people who it would appear have no legal right to register them and trying to convince us there is a land rush when there clearly isn't. I have to say that I am probably getting more traffic from Davengari numerals even in dot net!!!

Thanks for your support.

Dave Wrixon

**Acro** · 03-30-2005, 04:14 PM

Hahaha, I hit a nerve it seems. Turning a useless PR about IDN "news" into a personal attack. Typical - I always speak my mind and my statements are educated and don't aim to please.

What a bunch of BS!

And you post that at news? I would too, if I had invested thousands of dollars in useless hieroglyphics.

As for the .in lists - I never claimed it is a landrush. I said - factually, because I had daily figures - that the 3-letter domain market in that extension is untapped but the good letter combos are going fast. BTW, a major 3-letter player in the .com realm ordered the 3-letter .in list, I'm sure that tells something. And btw, anyone can register .in domains. More propaganda from the IDN peanut gallery :-D

In the meantime here's some IDN for you: ΜΑΛΑΚΙΕΣ.COM

**Rubber Duck** · 03-30-2005, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RADiSTAR

Hahaha, I hit a nerve it seems. Turning a useless PR about IDN "news" into a personal attack. Typical - I always speak my mind and my statements are educated and don't aim to please.

What a bunch of BS!

And you post that at news? I would too, if I had invested thousands of dollars in useless hieroglyphics.

As for the .in lists - I never claimed it is a landrush. I said - factually, because I had daily figures - that the 3-letter domain market in that extension is untapped but the good letter combos are going fast. BTW, a major 3-letter player in the .com realm ordered the 3-letter .in list, I'm sure that tells something. And btw, anyone can register .in domains. More propaganda from the IDN peanut gallery :-D

In the meantime here's some IDN for you: ΜΑΛΑΚΙΕΣ.COM

I am sorry but with nearly 300 Views so far and some congratulatory messages, this thread would appear to be of genuine interest.

The degradation of the interchange appears to have been initiated by yourself.

It would be I that apparently have hit the
nerve.

Speaking your mind is one thing. A democratic right recognised by all. The right to utter