New Bill Threatens Domain Registrants and Poses Risks to Internet Commerce

[draggar]

Has any one found what the guys at Google think about the Snow Bill?
If any one, I think Google and a few others can stop the Snow Bill.

Google may be one of the biggest losers if this passes, next to the actual domain owners who get find thousands to millions.

[Focus]

If this bill passes I'm moving out of this country

[karter9977]

Thanks Adam for sending out the email. Hopefully we get a lot more people to sign the petition.

[draggar]

If this bill passes I'm moving out of this country

And the domains to a new registrar, the Hosting to an out of the US host, and all DNS records outside of the US.

[Focus]

This bill will help to destroy the US economy and put companies out of business..do they realize that?

[jaydub]

Just signed

[Focus]

Keep signing everyone! Make sure you use your real name and info! Don't be afraid! You have EVERYTHING to lose and also EVERYTHING to gain here! We must unite together and stop this monster before it destroys us all and destroys our business!

[Onward]

You can also get your spouse to sign if they believe in defeating this.

[rush]

I got my spouse to sign this as well.

I know this may be a little off topic, but one of my names is a somewhat generic $xx,xxx name that I'd like to trademark, just so I can sleep a LITTLE better at night. Can anyone point me in the right direction for trademarking a domain?

[Focus]

If you don't mind spending a little money to have a professional assist you, I recommend a good TM attorney like John Berryhill

[Domainator]

Wife and I both signed sealed and delivered!

This bill is arrogance and stupidity rolled into a three dollar bill....unbelievable.

[draggar]

If you don't mind spending a little money to have a professional assist you, I recommend a good TM attorney like John Berryhill

He might give a discount considering all the crap he might have to deal with if this bill passes.

[Focus]

The US legal system will be over-run with BS if this "Bill" ever get's passed..not to mention it will spell the death of the US economy relative to the Internet...hell, I will even go so far as to say this Bill could cause a damn world war!

[draggar]

Here is what gets me.

I have a client who was illegally .com'ed last year. The person put up a site acting like my client, is even selling illegal copies of his book. We don't have the money for a WIPO. (The owner of the .com is also outside of the US).

With his permission, I registered the .net, .org, and .info of his name and put up a site on the .org (301'ed the other 2 to the .org). I also put up a site for him and I am selling legal copies of his books. I also have a section about the truth of the .com site (it is not him and the books are illegal copies that were published with stolen money).

The killer is that if this law passes, the fraudulent owner of the .com would have the right to not only take my domains PLUS sue me, and my client, for "damages" and lost sales since the .com site was up and this could be viewed as "bad faith".

[jaydub]

I think registrars will have to hope this doesn't pass as well. Domainers without a doubt have millions of domains reg'd with them....year in..year out.. If this passes and it becomes to dangerous to reg names on future potential without them getting popped, that revenue stream will vanish. And if they think corprate will reg names when they don't have to any more....that is just wishful thinking..

[IBN]

SenatorOlympiaSnowe.com is a parked page.

Should forward it to a dominatrix/femdom site.

The Coalition Against Domain Name Abuse ("CADNA") is a 501(c)(6)
non-profit organization dedicated to ending the systemic domain name abuses
that plague the Internet today. Its members include the following global
corporations: American International Group, Inc.; Bacardi & Company
Limited; Compagnie Financiere Richemont SA; Dell Inc.; Eli Lilly and
Company; Hilton Hotels Corporation; HSBC Holdings plc; Marriott
International, Inc.; Verizon Communications Inc.; and Wyndham Worldwide
Corporation. For more information, please visit cadna.org

Isn't the 501(c)(6) the same organization that launched the "Swift Boat" attack ads against John Kerry?

CADNA™

see www.cadna.com

Sometimes I think domainers shoot themselves in the foot.

After the Virginia Tech shootings, more domain names were registered at a faster pace than any other time in history. Tens of thousands of domain names were registered in a matter of hours relating to this tragedy breaking a previous record set by Hurricane Katrina.

Many on this and other forums were steadfast in preaching their right to reg what ever the hell they please and used the nonsensical rationale "if the media is profiting off of it then so can I."

The issue, as it was repeated time and time again, was that it is the media's task and responsibility to report the news and follow-up. It was not domainers' responsibility to reg the tens of thousands of domain names for the sake of being the first one to get it.

Within hours, bogus memorial funds were established and set up seeking donations. One particular individual came on this very forum to sell his VT domain names with a heart wrenching sob story while all the domains were forwarded to adult and penis enlargement sites.

I can not recall so much press given to domain names, domaining, registrars, and web sites in the week that followed. Story after story regarding the BS sites, the money made off of a name, parking, and what was on Cho's arm made headlines and the news on the internet and local and national television media. Not a single word of it was good or in a positive light.

But yet many on this forum continued to insist that it was their right.

Myself and a couple of other members warned that this would only bring intense scrutiny on the domainers and domaining industry especially going into an election year.

It did not matter if anyone felt it was their "right" and "it is no different than the media making a buck off of it mentality." Those same sharp witted domainers forgot one thing. Mass media is powerful and influential. Domainers are not.

The media had the ability to pick up this story and broadcast it all over the planet followed by the domain registration fiasco also broadcast all over the planet.

Call it grand standing or what ever you want to call it, this has all the markings of exactly what I was referring to. Senators attempting to pass a bill limiting the use of domain names in attempts of curbing phishing scams and illegal activity. In an election year. Imagine that.

Sure, we can say this new bill is all directly related to commerce and industry. But we know its not. We can say that the VT massacre has nothing to do with this but we know that isn't true.

Not all pit bulls are bad dogs.

But it is what people do with pit bulls that give pit bulls a bad name.

I live in a county where they are now trying to pass an ordinance outlawing the breeding of pit bulls along with 4 other breeds that are deemed dangerous.

Hey, not all domainers are bad folks.

But it is what domainers do with domains that give domainers and domains a bad name.

and I can only assume sites like this too......

http://www.hackforums.net/showthread.php?tid=3634

http://www.hackforums.net/showthread.php?tid=11723

http://www.hackforums.net/showthread.php?tid=12000

[Focus]

what complete idiots...what they are doing for instance has NOTHING to do with domains

[socalboy]

Quite a bill in its current form. Even has criminal provisions. Not enough just to trademark a parked domain, you need to be running a legit business providing goods and services. I think online publishing still wins, but it doesn't look like just selling email addresses will cut it anymore. And look at those potential fines, and punitive damages. Certainly has a chilling effect. What happens to the parking page? And who cares if they're regged overseas. ICANN is in the US. You get an injunction and serve ICANN forcing the turnover.

[Jacksplat]

What the big deal - if a domain has value and you as the owner are actually using it, file a trademark with the USPTO and get a trademark

Otherwise, the presumption is in part that you may be infringinging

I've been applying for my TM's @ cipo. It's affordable, simple to do it yourself, just takes a while to finalize.

Does any one tm office hold any more clout than another ? Or is it the best choice to simply apply for your tm in your own country ? Is any one countries tm office quicker than the other ?

Kevin

[boz]

I'm an international businessperson and I also use trademarks to protect my business, but this misuse of trademarks in the U.S. to grab domain names is utter bullshit. As others have said, in may cases domain names have been held for years before someone comes along, trademarks a similar name and then tries to use that to grab a lucrative pre-existing domain name.

I've had issues with crackhead trademark holders in the U.S. attempting to scare me into giving up .com and .net domain names that I have held since the 1990's and that preceded their applications for trademarks.

One notable issue was with a small firm in eastern U.S.A. who specialised in one specific product line. They tried to cease-and-desist me into giving up a series of domain names I had held since the 1990's that had a similar and also same name and that DIDN'T trade globally in the same area they had trademarked. I had taken these domain names to develop a global portal and wanted to protect against scammers by locking in all similar domain names. This was back in the days when we had to pay over $100 per domain name (ahh, those halycon days when one company monopolised everything).

My argument against these U.S. idiots was that:

a) their trademark was only specific to one TM class, which I was not doing commerce in (trademarks have 40-odd different international classes - for the tm claim to succeed, the claimant would have to either hold all TM classes OR the relevant classes that you are trading under ie they hold a U.S. TM for clothes and you are selling clothes on your site using a domain name the same as their TM)

b) .com, .net, .org, etc domain names are NOT U.S.-specific and were never intended to be - hence the widespread international useage of .com and .net domain names. The domain .us is designed specifically for use by U.S.-based entities or citizens.

c) their trademark was only applicable to the U.S.

d) I hold various trademarks in my country for the same name and therefore I have prior and superior rights to trade under my domain name, as long as I don't trade in their specific product in the U.S. The simple way around this if you're worried that your website is being viewed in the U.S. and that you may infringe their trademark is to put a statement on your website saying that the (possibly infringing) products cannot be purchased by U.S. citizens.

e) I told them that if I ever decided to trade in the specific product they had the trademark for, then I wouldn't be stupid enough to think that I could use the same name as it was clear they had prior rights to that TM. Well I didn't quite use that phrase, but it was close enough.

f) I finished by saying that if they wished to continue the matter, then my lawyer (a highly-skilled IP lawyer in this country and a business partner) would pass the matter to his colleagues at **** (a highly-regarded IP law firm in LA) for continuance within the U.S

The long and the short of it is that you have to stand up to these blood-sucking clowns IF they really have no right to do this. Threaten lawsuits - you might find (as in the above case) that they may be small-time and that while they're happy to threaten you, they actually have no stomach for a fight when the situation is reversed. Typical school-yard bully stuff.

Some of the actions of these people is similar to that of racketeers - coercion, bullying, threats to gain something that they have no legal right to. Stand up to them.

If someone thratens to take you to WIPO, raise the stakes - research your opponent's case, then contract an IP lawyer to begin the litigation threat round of letters.

Know your opponent.

Do some reading and find out your rights regarding tradmearks and domain names.

Find a good IP lawyer (make sure they're specialists - don't use the lawyer you use for everyday divorce cases). Use them.

If someone has already registered the trademark, generally they may only have registered it in one class. Go and register it in another class to give you a claim. Fight them.

If you live and trade outside the U.S., get a trademark to protect yourself. Most U.S. trademark holders can't afford to hold trademarks outside one country - it's too expensive. However the big players do, so watch it.

On the other hand:

Don't infringe existing trademarks - be careful about this. The law is generally that anyone can register a trademark if it isn't already registered. So even if you've been running smartcalculators.com for 10 years, someone can still come along and attept to register it if you haven't already. However, as mentioned in other posts, you can oppose the application, but you don't have a long timeframe to do this. See above about yu registering a name.

Don't think you can take on the Macca's and the Coca-Cola's of the world. Certain companies DO pretty much have general claims to their trademark in all classes and you'd be a fool to think otherwise. This is nothing to do with big business etc - this is to do with the fact that they've spent years and money developing their brand strategy and they won't allow anyone to infringe. It's a bit like domain names really. If you want to develop a strong domain name strategy, you don't just grab the .com, do you?

Generic words CAN be trademarked, but only in classes where they don't have direct generic useage. So "calculator" cannot be registered in the class covering electronics, computers etc, but you could probably register it in say, pet food, as it doesn't describe a generic form of that class. See an expert lawyer OR read up.

Know when to fight and when not to. Litigation is costly. But it's usually the same for your opponent.

I've been applying for my TM's @ cipo. It's affordable, simple to do it yourself, just takes a while to finalize.

Does any one tm office hold any more clout than another ? Or is it the best choice to simply apply for your tm in your own country ? Is any one countries tm office quicker than the other ?

Kevin

It's faster and easier to do it in your own country. Registering overseas as well is a lot more expensive and has definite timelines, so you need to research that.

As I say, either read carefully and understand the regulations, or hire expert advice.