Not appearing in google search results!

[DaddyHalbucks]

Doesn't Google automatically sandbox all domains for the first year?

[Mr.Domains]

No, that is a complete myth. I've had new domains indexed within a week and PR5 at the next update. Maybe as far as SERPs are concerned, then new domains MAY be treated differently, but I don't really even buy that... I think the whole sandbox theory is over-rated.

[Marval]

Mr Domains - totally agree and that has been supported by Googles reps on the boards since the "theory" of sandboxing first appeared a few years ago.
It just happened to appear at the same time that Google first implemented filters for previously expired domains that had pre-existing DMOZ and other SE links - and about the same time Google received their accredidation as a registrar
I've never seen a domain that was free and clear get "sandboxed" and with the way I do free site biz it would have shown up immediately if it really existed - and like you - have never had any problems with delays

One thing of note - lately Ive seen the DMOZ expired old link domains working again - although the only people Ive seen successful with it are doing some heavy duty cloaking for Google as well

[Mr.Domains]

Marval, it seems like you and I could benefit from sharing some SEO knowledge and experiences. Another interesting "quirk" I've noticed, is that having different "c-class" cluster IP's is not nearly as important as people tend to believe. Recently I had 60+ domains go from PR0 to PR6, when their only backlinks came from within the same IP cluster. And they were getting top 10 SERPs for their keywords. I think maybe if you are competing for the no.1 spot on a competetive keyword, then IP cluster may be a factor, but I don't think they have nearly as much effect on your overall ranking as most people believe.

I'd be interested in hearing more about your DMOZ expired domains theory, that is something I haven't really experimented with, but I have had quite a bit of success in converting expired PR domains.

[Sinfully Wicked]

Actually the Google Sandbox is alive and well but it operates in a different wat than it used to. Now the only way you get put in the sandbox is by an aggressive link building.

If you had a new domain and went out full force gathering lets say 1000 back links for example, you WILL get penalized and your site will be in the honeymoon period. Especially if the back links are from a non-relevent site/page.

If your ok with it, when the site end's it's honeymoon you will have all the back links and you carry on as normal.

Oh and you only stay in the sandbox for 90-120 days max.

Sin

[Mr.Domains]

Sin, is that from first-hand experience, or just what you've read on other forums?

(I couldn't help notice that your "SEO is EASY" site has a pagerank of zero.)

[Sinfully Wicked]

Lol i don't read other related SEO forums because quite honestly ther full of shit. 90% of SEO stuff out there is a load of crap and most what i read here and on namepros.com is a load of crap.

The problem is there are to many "SEO Experts" out there that know nothing. I find it rather funny when you see some one ask a simple question then you get some "expert" breaking everything down into into something that the originaly OP didn't even ask.

This thread for example.

Of course it has a PR0, the is because the site has only been up a short period of time.

And it's from experience, all 9 years of experience if not longer.

Here is something for you "experts" that i wrote in my newsletter yesterday.

Here is a question from one of our subscribers::

Hi Lee,

I have been doing SEO for 2 years now and I have read so much about the sandbox so I was just wondering what your take was on it, does it exist or doesn't it?

Miroslav

++Lee's Response++

Miroslav,

I'm glad you asked that because "I" personally think it DOES still exist but just not as it used to.

Throughout my years doing SEO there have been many variations of the "sandbox" and I have read myself many reasons why sites get stuck in it.

Many of the people who talk about the sandbox are people who have just brought a new domain, put up a site and start going link building like there's not tomorrow or adding hundreds of pages across the week.

See the problem with that is when you do that, it will red flag Google and Google will deem that as un-natural, they might think it is an auto-submitter. If Google spots this they will penalize you by putting your site in the "sandbox", basically not indexing it or if they do index it, the back link strength will not be as strong as it would be if your site was online for two years say.

Many people think the sandbox is a bad thing, but I don't, not at all because when your site does come out of the sandbox, all the links you gathered will be there still so it really isn't as bad as people think.

The normal length of time to be sandboxed is 90 to 120 days, so if you can sweat that out, all is good.

I personally believe it is all to do with how you build links, my advice will be to start slow then gradually build up speed, maybe 10 back links one week, then 20 the next and so on, THIS looks natural to Google and that is what I would do with a new site.

I hope this help Miroslav but read below because I am going to explain in detail how to avoid the sandbox effect.

Lee


How To Avoid The Sandbox Effect.

Google refuses to acknowledge its existence, but it does say that it's algo's may exhibit a "Sandbox-like" effect.

Ok. So, let's build links to our site in such a way to avoid the "Sandbox-like" effect. And one of the ways you do that is by building as many links to your interior pages as you do to your index (Home) page.

So for a second, forget about the tech. At some point, there's bound to be an exploit - as there was with High Trust Rank Subdomains and 301 Re-Directs.

Instead, lets focus on the Strategy: The Long-Tail keywords are less effected by the Sandbox-like effect because the Long Tail is less competitive.

And because it's less competitive, it's easier to rank for as we all know.

Now, in my experience, social networking behavior is part and parcel of Google's original strategy - remember they talk about the "Uniquely Democratic" nature of the web. It's all of the commercialization that disrupts their pure intentions.

Social networking behavior is citation based. Meaning, if you talk about another page on the internet, it's almost certainly not going to be the home page, especially when it comes to specific citation - like in the case with Blogs. In fact, when you quote another's blog, even if it's a story on the home page, that blog has a perma-link where the story will live internally to the domain.

Non-Commercial behavior is the most pure form of social behavior, and in my opinion, it's how Google is loaded to operate.

Get links to your internal pages. Get links FROM internal pages to your internal page - like in the case of articles. Make your linking strategy 50% internal pages and 50% index, or for your main keyword.

NOW, this is only one example. So, don't assume that this tactic is going to be the end-all. Do it because from a Long-Tail perspective, it makes total strategic and tactical sense. And if/when the anti-sandbox effect happens.

And that's it, it's all about how you build your links.

You and a few other "experts" should sign up - you might learn a thing or two.

Sin

[Marval]

I would have to say that your example of a "sandbox" relects the natural course of getting listed in Google as it has been since they first appeared on the scene - 2-3 months is typical listing times and has been for years.
The sandbox effect that most people started complaining about 3 years ago was a new algo shift that would delay even being indexed and botted for 6 months to a year - with the occasional robots text request.

I suppose if you are going to define the normal Google behavior for botting, listing and building internal page indexing as sandboxing - then I would have to agree that Google has had a sandbox - since they first started their search engine - however I dont think that is the definition of sandbox that most people use

As far as experts - Im not one - I dont and have not ever charged for my services - and have freely given advice based on testing for 6 years now - through non-SEO boards and articles I have written on the subject for some leading industry online newsletters.
I suppose that I should give a disclaimer as I dont guarantee results however since Ive never even thought about charging for it I guess I dont feel its necessary - but I can tell you that all of the companies that got advice from me did take their top spots for their desired words and phrases and have shown their appreciation in many other ways over the years - and they still retain those spots that I would guess are some of the most competitive spots based on adwords prices for them.

I would like to know what experiences you had with SEs prior to Google if youve been doing this for 9 years or so - as Ive always been interested in how others fared with one specific engine and their blacklist effects

[Sinfully Wicked]

The problem is to many people have forgot about what a search engine is and what it does. Like you mentioned in your first paragraph, it's natural cause, indeed you are right but most people don't know what that is anymore because everything has been so blown out of proportion.

All of the SE's have limits of what there tolerance level is for things. We could sit here for hours going through all of the things over time what Google allow where as Yahoo/MSN dosen't allow and reverse.

The sandbox thing, that is something that "i" believe in, it dosen't mean that i'm right nor am i wrong. I guess it's all down to what you want to believe. I know if Google does apply the sandbox, i'll be safe. If it dosen't exist in some form, then i have wasted some time when i have been working on projects.

The only people who truley know if there is a sanbox or not is Google.

Sin

[Mr.Domains]

You and a few other "experts" should sign up - you might learn a thing or two.

Sin, I'm not sure why you are refering to me as an "expert", (in quotes). I never professed to be one. In fact, I started my post with "Another interesting 'quirk' I've noticed...", you were the one who stepped in an professed to know everything.

I only asked if your "expertise" was from personal experience, because, from my 9 years in the business, my experience has been that the people that think they know the most about Google's algos are usually the ones that know the least...

[stevesko]

the people that think they know the most about Google's algos are usually the ones that know the least...

As someone who other generally consider an expert in SEO.... I couldnt agree more. Most "experts" know little more than those of us in the trenches. The only ones that I have found to truly know more are the guys from Planet Ocean (searchenginenews.com) ... I have been a subscriber for years.

Steve

[fab]

Yes, at least one of my sites got dropped completely from Google all of a sudden. I saw this tremendous drop in traffic from 1k down to 100-200. I checked the domain.com in Google, and it shows xx,xxx sites and only lists app. 40, all of which have my domain in their content, and none of my actual domain, similarly, site:domain.com has nothing. My server went down for a number of hours, and apparently the Googlebot missed me. This was almost my only site that had a number of first pages in Google.

If the site hasn't been banned, approximately how long will it take to get reindexed, I've notice the Googlebot has come back to the site, after it was removed.

[stevesko]

If your site has a grey bar in the google pagerank, it is banned, otherwise, it just got de-indexed for some reason, your server being down can be one of them... if so, the next time the bots come by, they will find you again... if you are Grey barred, this is much worse... you first must think what you did to get banned... then remove those potentially offending things ASAP. You can also get help from google, sometimes they will tell you what you have done wrong.. I haven't used this but I hear it works...

Steve