Bill Clinton to campaign for Obama - Help or Hurt?

[jasdon11]

Originally Posted by bd77

Do yourself a favor and worry about your own country. Its always the same thing with you liberals here if I don't agree with you I'm either stupid, gullible or brainwashed.

Actually, probably all three.

And no, it is the US that worries me. The UK is more embarrassing than worrying, because we are in your pocket and will follow wherever you go.

[bd77]

Originally Posted by nameslave

To be fair though, democracy is about letting everybody incl. the stupid ones to decide. True, this sometimes leads to undesirable results when populists stir up people's emotion. We have Hitler, McCarthy, and the genrally panicked post-9/11 American public. But then, humanity always survives (e.g. the U.S. public is eventually turning around); and there is actually no better way to check and balance whom we entrust our lives and freedom. As long as the institution of free elections stay, the dark days will finally be over.

I don't mind arguing with you about politics but don't call me stupid just because I don't agree with you. When liberals resort to name calling it makes you look like you have lost the argument. The rest of your statement is same old tired argument your side has been using for years now. Its not even worth my time to comment on.

Originally Posted by jasdon11

Actually, probably all three.

And no, it is the US that worries me. The UK is more embarrassing than worrying, because we are in your pocket and will follow wherever you go.

How would you like it if I insulted you? You wouldn't like it very much I bet. Just remember the more insults you throw my way the weaker your arguments look. This a failed tactic used by the left time and time again and one of the many reasons liberalism holds no appeal for Americans anymore.

[jasdon11]

Originally Posted by bd77

How would you like it if I insulted you? You wouldn't like it very much I bet. Just remember the more insults you throw my way the weaker your arguments look. This a failed tactic used by the left time and time again and one of the many reasons liberalism holds no appeal for Americans anymore.

I didn't mean to insult you - I apologise if you are.

Not matter how heated these 9/11 and political threads get, I don't mean any malice to anyone on this board; I take them pretty light-heartedly.

[Raider]

Originally Posted by jasdon11

Oh brother...you guys have no idea about terrorism.

In the UK we lived with the constant threat from the IRA for nearly three decades. If a terrorist wants to do something, they will. It's pretty much as simple as that.

You also lived next door to Ireland for 3 + decades.

I will agree with you that if somebody wants to commit a crime, they will. But a planned mass killing like what we had on 911, I'd say its highly unlikely under the leadership of a President who considers Homeland Security a top priority.

[biggedon]

Originally Posted by jasdon11

Unbelievable!

So you actually believe that a BS war in Iraq is keeping terrorists away from the US??? Maybe they can't get a visa huh....or is it the queues at the airports? Being a suicide bomber just ain't so easy any more....

Don't you think that it's just a teeny bit strange that there haven't been any attacks for 7 years - even though there are now millions more people with a grudge against America? We're talking people who would happily blow themselves up if it meant they took out one of you. Terrorists, terrorists, terrorists - how many times have you been brainwashed with that word?

Don't kid yourself - 'real' terrorists cannot be defeated by wars. It's like trying to change someones beliefs by force; can't be done.

The next time The States takes a hit, will be as a precursor to invade another country.

What is truly frightening, is that people so gullible are allowed to vote!

agree



it's like what one of mcCain's supporters said,
"that if another terrorist attack happened before the election, McCain would surely win".



it's either "fear of terrorists" or "change for a new direction", that will decide this election.



BTW:

I went to see comedian Chris Rock in concert last night in Chicago.

he asked the question..."how can Ben Laden, who's been hiding in a cave somewhere with no electricity, keep making new videos every few months?"

[Seraphim]

Originally Posted by biggedon

I went to see comedian Chris Rock in concert last night in Chicago.

he asked the question..."how can Ben Laden, who's been hiding in a cave somewhere with no electricity, keep making new videos every few months?"

He still has a few months left on his contract with Universal Studios... and Palm Springs is hardly a cave.

[bd77]

Originally Posted by biggedon

agree



it's like what one of mcCain's supporters said,
"that if another terrorist attack happened before the election, McCain would surely win".



it's either "fear of terrorists" or "change for a new direction", that will decide this election.



BTW:

I went to see comedian Chris Rock in concert last night in Chicago.

he asked the question..."how can Ben Laden, who's been hiding in a cave somewhere with no electricity, keep making new videos every few months?"

I find it interesting that a Mod would comment in a political thread. I new from the beginning that was part of the minority here.

Its true that McCain would handle a terrorist threat much better that Obama. Its a simple fact IMO. You said there is two options and one of them is to go in a new direction. Obama is not a new direction he believes in the same old failed policies of the left, one being appeasement of our enemies. He just speaks real well and everybody gets excited.

BTW Osama Bin Laden just doesn't live in a cave, he has free rain throughout Pakistan and parts of Afghanistan and who's fault is this our so called ally Pervez Musharraf who won't allow us to send ground troops into northern Pakistan to get Osama and his ilk.

[jasdon11]

Originally Posted by biggedon

it's like what one of mcCain's supporters said,
"that if another terrorist attack happened before the election, McCain would surely win".

Brace yourselves!

[Raider]

Originally Posted by biggedon

it's either "fear of terrorists" or "change for a new direction", that will decide this election.

Ah Yes, the famous "Change" word, It sure does sound good but nobody knows if that "Change" will be good or bad.

JFK used the same message, and he delivered on that message giving us plenty of "Change", Like Obama, he gave us his inexperience...

His meeting with Kruschev that led to the Cuban Missle Crisis.

The Bay of Pigs invasion, 4000-5000 Killed.

Record increase in military presence in Vietnam, 800 to 16,300.
Total dead: 285,831 Total wounded: 1,490,000

Allowing the construction of the Berlin wall, The wall that Ronald Reagan tore down!.

All this in only 2 years and 9 months as President, that's some "Change"

[jasdon11]

Originally Posted by Raider

Ah Yes, the famous "Change" word, It sure does sound good but nobody knows if that "Change" will be good or bad.

JFK used the same message, and he delivered on that message giving us plenty of "Change", Like Obama, he gave us his inexperience...

His meeting with Kruschev that led to the Cuban Missle Crisis.

The Bay of Pigs invasion, 4000-5000 Killed.

Record increase in military presence in Vietnam, 800 to 16,300.
Total dead: 285,831 Total wounded: 1,490,000

Allowing the construction of the Berlin wall, The wall that Ronald Reagan tore down!.

All this in only 2 years and 9 months as President, that's some "Change"

As I understand it, the US didn't actually enter combat in Vietnam until 1965 - two years after JFK was killed. How do you blame it on a dead guy?

And the Berlin Wall.....you surely can't credit the US in either putting it up or pulling it down - what next, gonna say an American discovered Europe?

This shows how out of whack with reality you are.

[bd77]

Originally Posted by jasdon11

As I understand it, the US didn't actually enter combat in Vietnam until 1965 - two years after JFK was killed. How do you blame it on a dead guy?

Its a fact that JFK escalated war in Vietnam. It was he who pushed for a bigger US role there. The war itself was brought on by French inaction to the growing communist threat led by China in 1959.

And the Berlin Wall.....you surely can't credit the US in either putting it up or pulling it down - what next, gonna say an American discovered Europe?

Ronald Reagan was mostly responsible for the fall of the Berlin wall. Since it coincides with the fall of the Soviet Union.

[jasdon11]

Originally Posted by bd77

Its a fact that JFK escalated war in Vietnam. It was he who pushed for a bigger US role there. The war itself was brought on by French inaction to the growing communist threat led by China in 1959.



Ronald Reagan was mostly responsible for the fall of the Berlin wall. Since it coincides with the fall of the Soviet Union.

The way I understand history, is that JFK was killed because he didn't want Vietnam to escalate into combat. The undeniable fact is that he was two years dead by the time combat started.

And could you please explain just what Ronald Reagan did towards the fall of the Soviet Union? There are a lot of Russians who might think they did more....

[fab]

Originally Posted by jasdon11

The way I understand history, is that JFK was killed because he didn't want Vietnam to escalate into combat. The undeniable fact is that he was two years dead by the time combat started.

And could you please explain just what Ronald Reagan did towards the fall of the Soviet Union? There are a lot of Russians who might think they did more....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War

The Vietnam War, also known as the Second Indochina War, or the Vietnam Conflict, occurred from 1959[9] to April 30, 1975. The war was fought between the communist Democratic Republic of Vietnam (North Vietnam), supported by its communist allies, and the US-supported Republic of Vietnam (South Vietnam).

[jasdon11]

From the piece you linked to:

The United States entered the war to prevent a communist takeover of South Vietnam (as part of a wider strategy of containment during the Cold War), beginning with military advisory missions in the early 1960s and escalating to full warfare with the deployment of combat units from 1965 onward. By 1973, almost all U.S. troops had left the theater and in 1975, communist forces assumed control of South Vietnam. North and South Vietnam were reunified shortly thereafter.

[fab]

As I understand it, the US didn't actually enter combat in Vietnam until 1965

Is not the same as:

and escalating to full warfare with the deployment of combat units from 1965 onward

Combat started here:

The United States entered the war to prevent a communist takeover of South Vietnam (as part of a wider strategy of containment during the Cold War), beginning with military advisory missions in the early 1960s

[jasdon11]

"didn't enter combat in Vietnam until 1965"


"deployment of combat units from 1965 onward"

Looks the same to me...

[Raider]

Originally Posted by jasdon11

"didn't enter combat in Vietnam until 1965"


"deployment of combat units from 1965 onward"

Looks the same to me...

What looks the same to me is your ignorance on yet another subject.

"President John F. Kennedy rounded another turning point in early 1961, when he secretly sent 400 Special Operations Forces-trained (Green Beret) soldiers to teach the South Vietnamese how to fight what was called counterinsurgency war against Communist guerrillas in South Vietnam. When Kennedy was assassinated in November 1963, there were more than 16,000 U.S. military advisers in South Vietnam, and more than 100 Americans had been killed"

Perhaps this might help you;

http://www.english.uiuc.edu/maps/vietnam/causes.htm

Originally Posted by jasdon11

As I understand it, the US didn't actually enter combat in Vietnam until 1965 - two years after JFK was killed. How do you blame it on a dead guy?

And the Berlin Wall.....you surely can't credit the US in either putting it up or pulling it down - what next, gonna say an American discovered Europe?

This shows how out of whack with reality you are.

Priceless


LOL