How to respond to this "interest"

[Steen]

Hi,

The domain in question IS a made up word and used by this (medium sized) company as their brand. They currently use an alternative TLD. I initiated the negotiations and after 2 months of silence I get this email:

Steen,

Would an offer of $x be suitable for you to transfer the "y.zzz' domain name

____.

Now I don't want to say "yes" and have it used against me later. How would I respond in a "yes" fashion.

Something like..

"If you were to offer $x for "y.zzz" I would definitely consider it" ?

Thank you.

[JoDomains]

I think that responding in a "yes fashion" can be used against you as responding "yes". Be careful.

[jazzpetals]

Simply email them back with another question..."Are you offering me $x for this domain?

[JoDomains]

and how is asking them "Are you offering me $x for this domain?" means responding in a "yes fashion" ??!!

[Steen]

Any more (maybe lawyer) opinions?

[Domagon]

No need to say yes nor no.

Say something like it's worth $X to me ... or use an analogy like 'It's worth more than my car [or coin collection, house, etc] to me' ... and leave it at that.

You're in tricky territory ... likely best to keep your correspondence terse and lacking in detail - if they really want it, they'll read between the lines and throw out a number. Say too much and they're just do a UDRP (and/or lawsuit) instead and use your 'words' against you; initiating the negotiations already has likely put you in a bad spot - on the bright side, if they had enough, they'd likely done a UDRP, etc already ...

Lastly, if you just want to get rid of the domain fast for not much money, then throw out a price like $1200 or whatever ... cheaper for them to pay a relatively small amount straight away than mess around with it, since any UDRP/legal action will likely cost them much more in time and hassle.

Ron

[Steen]

No need to say yes nor no.

Say something like it's worth $X to me ... or use an analogy like 'It's worth more than my car [or coin collection, house, etc] to me' ... and leave it at that.

You're in tricky territory ... likely best to keep your correspondence terse and lacking in detail - if they really want it, they'll read between the lines and throw out a number. Say too much and they're just do a UDRP (and/or lawsuit) instead and use your 'words' against you; initiating the negotiations already has likely put you in a bad spot - on the bright side, if they had enough, they'd likely done a UDRP, etc already ...

Lastly, if you just want to get rid of the domain fast for not much money, then throw out a price like $1200 or whatever ... cheaper for them to pay a relatively small amount straight away than mess around with it, since any UDRP/legal action will likely cost them much more in time and hassle.

Ron

Due to the undisclosed X value ($), setting the price at UDRP filing level isn't really an option. However, they did "offer" an amount (significantly less than this correspondence) in this fashion "We are prepare to offer $p dollars for the domain name
y.com
"

So now that they have changed format, has me a bit "tense". I was thinking of replying with something along the lines of:

"If you would like to make an offer, please do so. I am unable to offer any guidance on price without a you submitting a formal offer"

[ParkQuick.com]

I was thinking of replying with something along the lines of:

"If you would like to make an offer, please do so. I am unable to offer any guidance on price without a you submitting a formal offer"

I really like that response, but I hope that one of the attorneys weighs-in too. Discussions like this are helpful to me. I need to pay much more careful attention to how things like this are worded.

While I don't particularly enjoy paying sedo 10%, at least an offer through them is truly an offer.

[Domagon]

Due to the undisclosed X value ($), setting the price at UDRP filing level isn't really an option.

How far off is their price ... if it's like $100, then you can likely get them to $200 or even a bit more.

Ultimately, it comes down to what amount you want - trying to guess how high one is willing to go is like trying to guess when a stock is going to peak ... pick a number and go with it. If you seek $1000, then ask for that, or perhaps a bit more. Sure they could say no, but likely will counter it ... and from there you can negotiate and get the name sold, which in the end makes everyone happy ... it appears they don't really want to go UDRP, etc ... for if they did, they likely already would have.

Ron

...While I don't particularly enjoy paying sedo 10%, at least an offer through them is truly an offer.

An offer is an offer. Paying 10% to sedo in the mistaken belief that an offer there is somehow more binding is naive at best.

One should *not* assume it's a deal until money changes hands, and even then there are no guarantees; escrow exists for a reason ... some deals go bad even after paperwork has been signed and money changes hands.

Getting back to Sedo ... what do you think Sedo does when a party reneges on a deal?... basically nothing!

Sedo, Afternic, etc aren't in a position to enforce a deal ... those services are more akin to paid advertising than anything else; Sedo makes no secret about it with how they push PPC parking so hard instead of selling, but I digress.

Ron

P.S. the mod DNForum put in here that causes multiple posts to become one large post is annoying, and sometimes confusing ... but perhaps that's just me LOL!

[Steen]

Re: pricing:

The price disclosed in this latest email from them is far from UDRP filing fees. I know how to negotiate, I am trying to negotiate in a manner that would provide the most protection. Well, at least *I* think I know a bit about what I'm doing.

It's not about how much I want. The amount stated in this latest contact is an amount I would accept. I just am wondering how it would be best to get this "would you accept" phrase into "we will pay $x for the domain name" while keeping max protection off.

As stated before, the first email was an offer. This latest email was not. Thus I want to be careful in my response.

PS: I don't like the multiple post = one post mod either.

[Domagon]

Firstly, again I'm not an attorney, and thus this all my layman's opinion

If their offer is well below the UDRP/lawsuit filing fee level, then just accept their offer and move on ... say "yes", or "ok", or "sounds reasonable", or whatever ... it doesn't really matter, in my view, in this particular situation.

I seriously doubt they'd be emailing you a price, especially when it's so low like $100 (taking a wild guess; if their price is less than that ... consider just giving it to them for free [or delete] and move on), if they weren't serious about honoring it.

What would they sue you for ... there are no real damages, they are giving you an out, and thus the ball is in your court ...

Read the agreement (if it looks all good - obviously get professional legal advice if in doubt), sign/cash check, and be done with it.

Lastly, it sounds as if you're ready to deal, but is seeking reassurance ... not sure I'm helping you much there, but saying it the way I see it based on my experiences ... perhaps some other folks will be kind enough to reply to this thread too.

Ron

[HOWARD]

It sounds to me like you are concerned that you are using a domain that may be infringing someone's trademark. If not, you have no need to be concerned on how you answer the question. If their improperly phrased "offer" is within your range, just accept it. If not, let them know how much you will take for it (assuming that it's not someone's TM).

[seeker]

'well, my partner really wants the domain for his business and wants to develop it. I guess I can talk him/her out of it if I had the right amount. It was after all purchased for developmet purposes'.

That should do it.

[Steen]

Firstly, again I'm not an attorney, and thus this all my layman's opinion

If their offer is well below the UDRP/lawsuit filing fee level, then just accept their offer and move on ... say "yes", or "ok", or "sounds reasonable", or whatever ... it doesn't really matter, in my view, in this particular situation.

I seriously doubt they'd be emailing you a price, especially when it's so low like $100 (taking a wild guess; if their price is less than that ... consider just giving it to them for free [or delete] and move on), if they weren't serious about honoring it.

What would they sue you for ... there are no real damages, they are giving you an out, and thus the ball is in your court ...

Read the agreement (if it looks all good - obviously get professional legal advice if in doubt), sign/cash check, and be done with it.

Lastly, it sounds as if you're ready to deal, but is seeking reassurance ... not sure I'm helping you much there, but saying it the way I see it based on my experiences ... perhaps some other folks will be kind enough to reply to this thread too.

Ron

I think you are in the wrong direction. The offer is not near $100, I would not waste everyone's time over such a case.

It sounds to me like you are concerned that you are using a domain that may be infringing someone's trademark. If not, you have no need to be concerned on how you answer the question. If their improperly phrased "offer" is within your range, just accept it. If not, let them know how much you will take for it (assuming that it's not someone's TM).

As I stated before, they do use the name and I could easily see them having "common law" trademark rights if this were in NAF or WIPO. They might already have a registered trademark, I wouldn't be surprised.

Thus I am being cautious here. I don't want to say "yes, if you were to offer $x I would accept" and then get a nice letter in the mail 5 days later.

[Acro]

I tell them to place an offer than would catch my attention - if they make the cut I'll email them.

Weeds out the idiots.

[OnSpec]

Hi,

The domain in question IS a made up word and used by this (medium sized) company as their brand. They currently use an alternative TLD. I initiated the negotiations and after 2 months of silence I get this email:


Now I don't want to say "yes" and have it used against me later. How would I respond in a "yes" fashion.

Something like..

"If you were to offer $x for "y.zzz" I would definitely consider it" ?

Thank you.

1) The domain is a made up word.

Common sense would suggest that they may have a hard time proving "bad faith" if they registered the alternative TLD and are using it as their business website.

2) They currently use an alternative TLD

Obviously they were happy with this situation or they would have obtained the .com version. If .com, was critical to their business, why didn't they attempt to get the domain before launching their website?


I have used the following wording, or similar, with some success in the past.


Thank you for your unsolicited request for information on "domain.com". As
you are likely aware, the value of .com domains is in constant flux and as such, we do not quote prices our domains.

The market will determine the value of the domain. If you are seriously interested in acquiring this domain, you are invited to offer the maximum price you are willing to pay.

If the price you offer falls within the range we expect, the domain
will be sold, no dickering back and forth. If any offer falls below
the range, we will keep the domain. We are happy to offer a free push to your
(registrar's) account, or if you prefer, any escrow costs will be to your
account.

Thank you for your interest in "domain.com"

Just my 2 cents and I am not a lawyer.

Good luck.

[Acro]

"no dickering back and forth"

Yes, mention that and they will run away screaming :-D

[namedropper]

1) The domain is a made up word.

Common sense would suggest that they may have a hard time proving "bad faith" if they registered the alternative TLD and are using it as their business website.

I not only don't get how that could possibly be "common sense" but I'm also having difficulty finding *any* sort of sense in that statement.

[Steen]

OnSpec, I am saying it's made up, not dictionary.

As in:
ebay.com to auction.com

[Dave Zan]

I not only don't get how that could possibly be "common sense" but I'm also having difficulty finding *any* sort of sense in that statement.

*sigh* Indeed. I've learned that lesson loooooooooooooong ago: what may be
"common" to one person may not be so to another.

Nice attempt anyway, OnSpec. But since you said "some success", what has
happened to those that didn't succeed? :-D