Open Debate - Please join in !!! - DNForum - Domain Sales, Domain Forum, Domain Appraisals, Domain Registrars

**LewR** · 08-12-2003, 02:10 PM

Thread now closed - thanks folks!!

**Spider** · 08-12-2003, 02:34 PM

d) A grey area that could go either direction
e) A really nice name that could earn some major $$

Has this corporation successfully won simular domains through UDRP casses?

**jberryhill** · 08-12-2003, 03:11 PM

"My ownership of #######s.com is:"

...set forth without any indication of (a) your intent in registering the domain name, or (b) what you are currently doing or plan to do with the domain name.

Your question boils down to something like:

I just killed someone. I will get:
(a) a medal
(b) a conviction for first degree murder
(c) an acquittal for manslaughter

On the facts stated, (a), (b), or (c) might be correct.

**LewR** · 08-12-2003, 03:37 PM

Thread now closed - thanks folks!!

**GT Web** · 08-12-2003, 03:46 PM

D - GREY AREA......we need more facts...and either way its tough to decide, so I will sit on the fench for now....good point jberryhill

**LewR** · 08-12-2003, 03:49 PM

Thread now closed - thanks folks!!

**jberryhill** · 08-12-2003, 04:11 PM

"Other than the name itself - I would be happy to provide any facts you would need to make a decision."

Oh, good. What is your checking account number?

**GT Web** · 08-12-2003, 04:13 PM

PIN# ?

**LewR** · 08-12-2003, 04:31 PM

Thread now closed - thanks folks!!

**jberryhill** · 08-12-2003, 11:48 PM

A lot of the discussions here treat all trademarks as if they were equal. They aren't. Also, the idea of a surname being "generic" in the trademark sense of the term seems a bit odd, unless the surname happens to be something like "Smith" which is also an English word for a person who pounds iron on an anvil.

When you say that #####.com is the company's website and ###### is "part" of the Company's name, those facts do not necessarily mean that ##### is used as a trademark by that company. Is it a distinctive part of the company's name? Are they primarily known as ######, or by the whole name?

And what about you? If I selectively went through all of the domain names you've ever owned or sold, would I be able to come up with enough terms that also happen to be trademarks, that I would be able to persuade a judge or UDRP panel that you've engaged in a pattern of registering trademarks?

It's not an "emotional debate", but it can be subjective, and can depend on how well you argue your point. Take Barcelona.com - a perfectly legitimate domain name registration. Now, it has taken one UDRP panelist, one federal judge, and then a panel of three appellate judges just to get that one boneheaded dispute to come out the right way. Was the registrant cybersquatting? No. Did it take years to prove that point? Yes.

JH3 also raises a relevant point about the history of enforcement that any of these parties might have had relative to similar variations on the term.

**LewR** · 08-13-2003, 12:21 AM

Thread now closed - thanks folks!!

**LewR** · 08-13-2003, 02:38 PM

Thanks to jh3 and jberryhill for posting - and gt for sitting on the fence...LOL

Looks like no one wants to discuss this in a generic sense - so I will pull the plug. It was a worthwhile expericment, and now I know the result...LOL

I Thank everyone for looking!!

**jberryhill** · 08-14-2003, 08:37 PM

"I Thank everyone for looking!!"

One of the reasons why I post here is to provide some general considerations for folks to think about, not to provide personal legal advice in response to specific questions. Going back and deleting the original question sort of defeats the purpose of having a public discussion, don' t you think?

**LewR** · 08-14-2003, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jberryhill
"I Thank everyone for looking!!"

One of the reasons why I post here is to provide some general considerations for folks to think about, not to provide personal legal advice in response to specific questions. Going back and deleting the original question sort of defeats the purpose of having a public discussion, don' t you think?

I normally leave everything on a thread. I will email more details.

Thank you!!

08-12-2003, 02:10 PM	#1 (permalink)
LewR DNF Regular Last Online: 10-31-2009 04:59 PM iTrader: (8) Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 751 DNF$: 52	Open Debate - Please join in !!! Thread now closed - thanks folks!! __________________ Lew Richards (LewR) LewR@Budweiser.com Last edited by LewR; 08-13-2003 at 02:40 PM..

08-12-2003, 03:11 PM	#3 (permalink)
jberryhill Philadelphia Lawyer Last Online: 09-18-2009 01:17 AM iTrader: (1) Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 2,987 DNF$: 6,350	"My ownership of #######s.com is:" ...set forth without any indication of (a) your intent in registering the domain name, or (b) what you are currently doing or plan to do with the domain name. Your question boils down to something like: I just killed someone. I will get: (a) a medal (b) a conviction for first degree murder (c) an acquittal for manslaughter On the facts stated, (a), (b), or (c) might be correct. __________________ John Berryhill Ph.d., esq. John-AT-johnberryhill.com Please do not send private messages via dnforum.com, email me directly.

08-12-2003, 03:37 PM	#4 (permalink)
LewR DNF Regular Last Online: 10-31-2009 04:59 PM iTrader: (8) Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 751 DNF$: 52	Thread now closed - thanks folks!! __________________ Lew Richards (LewR) LewR@Budweiser.com Last edited by LewR; 08-13-2003 at 02:40 PM..

08-12-2003, 03:46 PM	#5 (permalink)
GT Web DNF Addict Name: Daniel Last Online: 10-25-2009 04:41 PM iTrader: (24) Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 6,910 DNF$: 9,193 Location: Vancouver, Canada Country:	D - GREY AREA......we need more facts...and either way its tough to decide, so I will sit on the fench for now....good point jberryhill __________________

08-12-2003, 03:49 PM	#6 (permalink)
LewR DNF Regular Last Online: 10-31-2009 04:59 PM iTrader: (8) Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 751 DNF$: 52	Thread now closed - thanks folks!! __________________ Lew Richards (LewR) LewR@Budweiser.com Last edited by LewR; 08-13-2003 at 02:41 PM..

08-12-2003, 02:34 PM	#2 (permalink)
Spider Platinum Lifetime Member Name: Joe Spano Last Online: 10-26-2008 09:15 PM iTrader: (3) Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,610 DNF$: 0 Location: San Diego Country:	d) A grey area that could go either direction e) A really nice name that could earn some major $$ Has this corporation successfully won simular domains through UDRP casses?

08-12-2003, 04:11 PM	#7 (permalink)
jberryhill Philadelphia Lawyer Last Online: 09-18-2009 01:17 AM iTrader: (1) Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 2,987 DNF$: 6,350	"Other than the name itself - I would be happy to provide any facts you would need to make a decision." Oh, good. What is your checking account number? __________________ John Berryhill Ph.d., esq. John-AT-johnberryhill.com Please do not send private messages via dnforum.com, email me directly.

08-12-2003, 04:13 PM	#8 (permalink)
GT Web DNF Addict Name: Daniel Last Online: 10-25-2009 04:41 PM iTrader: (24) Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 6,910 DNF$: 9,193 Location: Vancouver, Canada Country:	PIN# ? __________________

08-12-2003, 04:31 PM	#9 (permalink)
LewR DNF Regular Last Online: 10-31-2009 04:59 PM iTrader: (8) Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 751 DNF$: 52	Thread now closed - thanks folks!! __________________ Lew Richards (LewR) LewR@Budweiser.com Last edited by LewR; 08-13-2003 at 02:41 PM..

08-12-2003, 11:48 PM	#10 (permalink)
jberryhill Philadelphia Lawyer Last Online: 09-18-2009 01:17 AM iTrader: (1) Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 2,987 DNF$: 6,350	A lot of the discussions here treat all trademarks as if they were equal. They aren't. Also, the idea of a surname being "generic" in the trademark sense of the term seems a bit odd, unless the surname happens to be something like "Smith" which is also an English word for a person who pounds iron on an anvil. When you say that #####.com is the company's website and ###### is "part" of the Company's name, those facts do not necessarily mean that ##### is used as a trademark by that company. Is it a distinctive part of the company's name? Are they primarily known as ######, or by the whole name? And what about you? If I selectively went through all of the domain names you've ever owned or sold, would I be able to come up with enough terms that also happen to be trademarks, that I would be able to persuade a judge or UDRP panel that you've engaged in a pattern of registering trademarks? It's not an "emotional debate", but it can be subjective, and can depend on how well you argue your point. Take Barcelona.com - a perfectly legitimate domain name registration. Now, it has taken one UDRP panelist, one federal judge, and then a panel of three appellate judges just to get that one boneheaded dispute to come out the right way. Was the registrant cybersquatting? No. Did it take years to prove that point? Yes. JH3 also raises a relevant point about the history of enforcement that any of these parties might have had relative to similar variations on the term. __________________ John Berryhill Ph.d., esq. John-AT-johnberryhill.com Please do not send private messages via dnforum.com, email me directly.

08-13-2003, 12:21 AM	#11 (permalink)
LewR DNF Regular Last Online: 10-31-2009 04:59 PM iTrader: (8) Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 751 DNF$: 52	Thread now closed - thanks folks!! __________________ Lew Richards (LewR) LewR@Budweiser.com Last edited by LewR; 08-13-2003 at 02:42 PM..

08-13-2003, 02:38 PM	#12 (permalink)
LewR DNF Regular Last Online: 10-31-2009 04:59 PM iTrader: (8) Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 751 DNF$: 52	Thanks to jh3 and jberryhill for posting - and gt for sitting on the fence...LOL Looks like no one wants to discuss this in a generic sense - so I will pull the plug. It was a worthwhile expericment, and now I know the result...LOL I Thank everyone for looking!! __________________ Lew Richards (LewR) LewR@Budweiser.com Last edited by LewR; 08-13-2003 at 02:42 PM..

08-14-2003, 08:37 PM	#13 (permalink)
jberryhill Philadelphia Lawyer Last Online: 09-18-2009 01:17 AM iTrader: (1) Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 2,987 DNF$: 6,350	"I Thank everyone for looking!!" One of the reasons why I post here is to provide some general considerations for folks to think about, not to provide personal legal advice in response to specific questions. Going back and deleting the original question sort of defeats the purpose of having a public discussion, don' t you think? __________________ John Berryhill Ph.d., esq. John-AT-johnberryhill.com Please do not send private messages via dnforum.com, email me directly.

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