Ouch.com (for sell or reselling) Part 2 ;)

[DotComGod]

ok, that one got huge, lets start a new one if you guys want to keep it going....

-=DCG=-

[Spider]

Thanks DCG, you are quick!


The other thread will start to die, so you can read it here....

http://dnforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=36141

[LewR]

I am not sure why there are any questions left.

Let's not reinvent the wheel here... No trust accounts are needed- just give the name back the original owner - let domainp pound salt, opencg (no possibly sober) can make payment arrangements with OpMagic.

Am I missing something here?

Have a great day - when I need another laugh, I will be back.

[Mr Webname]

Originally posted by LewR
No trust accounts are needed- just give the name back the original owner - let domainp pound salt, opencg (no possibly sober) can make payment arrangements with OpMagic.

Am I missing something here?

JB the lawyer thought a trust account was a good idea - I think you're missing the possibility of things going nasty if a mistake is made in who the name is handed back to. It's easy for everyone else here, after giving advice they can walk away - not so easy for attilio.

[StockDoctor]

I think it was (and is) a good thing for DCG and the mdoerators to keep this thread open. It's entertaining, but most importantly it gives domainP and opencg more rope to hang themselves.

It is obvious to the members that have read the full thread that opencg and domainP should be banned in any event at some point soon. More than that, the other forums should be made aware and ban them as well for the protection of their respective members.

I for one will not let up on this until they are banned from any and all forums I belong to.

I agree with whoever said that the members who read this whole thing should get a t-shirt saying "I read the Ouch Thread on DNF"

[izopod]

Originally posted by Mr Webname

It's easy for everyone else here, after giving advice they can walk away - not so easy for attilio.

Exactly....

Too many inconsistencies in stories being told here. What I find strange is that DomainP hung around as long as he did. Normally if someone has been caught in fraud they certainly don't hang around long enough to have their IP captured. I'm not saying DomainP is a good guy here, on the contrary.... The bad guy hung around longer than the "good" guy (Allen).

If you lost a name you thought was worth $10,000.00, I would be doing everything in my power, including calling in sick to work to get my domain back. Since everyone who could make this happen was right here on this forum, I really don't understand why "OpportunityMagic" has not posted very much...

Another thing that seemed "strange" in Opportunity Magic's comments about the FBI not wanting to get involved, UNLESS it involves more than $150,000 worth of goods. That doesn't add up. What if this was a part of a larger scam. They certainly would be interested in that. The only way they could find out is do some preliminary investigation.

I'm not convinced who is the rightful owner here... Maybe it is Allen, and it seems like he is, but nothing about this whole affair "seems" right.

[Attilio]

I repeat:

I would move the domain in a trust account right now if all the parties agree.

Actually I would move the domain anywhere the parties agree.

The domain as a good value once free of any legal issue, if the original owner would agree in consider that other people might have lost money during the sale history and all of them find a fair agreemet this matter could be solved quickly.

As I wrote many time alreday I do not claim any right on the domain.

I only want to be sure that none of the people involed and who desbursed money during the sale history might start any action against me if I transfer the domain to the wrong person.

Thanks,

[Mr Webname]

Originally posted by Attilio
I repeat:

I would move the domain in a trust account right now if all the parties agree.

I think you can do that without the agreement of others, just set up another Godaddy account and push it there, thus indicating your intention to hand the domain over to the lawful owner. Change the whois to something like "c/o attilio".

I only want to be sure that none of the people involed and who desbursed money during the sale history might start any action against me if I transfer the domain to the wrong person.
How will you be sure unless the opportunity has been given to the authorities ie police to take the matter up. An attempt has been made to defraud you by selling you a stolen domain name - is that not an offence in Mexico?

Thanks,

[Attilio]

Mr. webname,

I can do it right now if it can help but how this would change my position If will just change conatct info an continue holding password of the account, I undesrtand that to be a trust account it shoul be hold by a tird party trusted by all people involved.

Or am I wrong?

[Sharpy]

The domain is not worth $10,000 right now, it's worth $3000 as that is what's been offered. It is actually worth $18.95 as that is the only ammount that can be verrified as having been spent on the name.

If opencg paid $3000 to domainp, and domainp is everet wan, then that most likely explains why domainp hasn't posted in quite some time. He's flown the coop and opencg is fuxored.

Whatever account you move it to has to be with GoDaddy as they won't allow transfers before 60 days.

[Mr Webname]

Originally posted by Attilio
Mr. webname,

I can do it right now if it can help but how this would change my position If will just change conatct info an continue holding password of the account, I undesrtand that to be a trust account it shoul be hold by a tird party trusted by all people involved.

Or am I wrong?

I don't believe it is necessary to hand it over to a third party at all, in fact it could be dangerous to do so. I would set up an account independent to your own Godaddy account and change the whois to show that the domain is just in your care - you could make it merely "Trust Account" or even use the Godaddy service that removes your details from view if you feel nervous, I might well do that.
Having setup the account and moved the name I would inform all parties (including Godaddy) what you have done and report the matter including the threat made to youto your local police chief.
Let the authorities decide who should have the name, be it police or the civil law. Once an "authority" steps in then that is your route out of this situation.

[JMJ]

The only one who has apparently shown proof of legitimate ownership and payment is Allen. Sit back and enjoy the scammers get busted Allen and wait until the time you get your property back.

Attillo, it wouldn't really matter what account you stick it in you're still going to have to be involved in the situation no matter how screwed up that may be so just leave it be no since in bringing an additional party in to make things more confusing.

DomainP you're a joke, I guess with those worldwide connections you have somebody in Tennessee also? Send them over to see this country boy and why not you come along with them?

opencg get over it, if you did send the funds you got scammed just like the original owner. So in all actuality you will mst likely be the loser in the end in any court. In my state I'm not sure about yours but buying stolen property will actually end you up in jail just as easy as stealing it yourself.

[winfreecash]

Attilio,

There is not a magical easy answer for you. ANY decision you make COULD have negative consequences for you. Unless a person can see into the future they cannot tell you just who might come after you.

Mr Berryhill has made it clear that you have NO obligation to opencg so one decision has clearly been defined.

If you truly believe it has been stolen, then as Mr Berryhill also pointed out, there is little likelyhood that the theif would walk you into a courtroom.

Also, by whose laws do you want to comply...Russian, American, Mexican????

As for the physical threats to you and yours....if you give in to those, it will only be a short while before you are threatened for MORE!!!!

I believe I read into Mr Berryhills message that the ONLY way for you to comply with the few laws that are clear is to complete your contract with domainp by paying him the 3k you promised then giving the domain to Allen...then there is nobody left to "come after you". That choice clearly stinks so you are left with a moral choice as the legal answer given to you at your request is unsuitable to you as it would be to all of us.

[actnow]

Attillo, I would move it into another GoDaddy acct as described above.

You don't want someone to totally freeze your acct at GoDaddy and effect your other domains.

[Attilio]

I have my idea about the story as each other has is one, but I am not a judge nor a policemen and I can not do any assumption.

For the moment I will forget the threat I have suffered and simply state the fact as I can see it.

Opprtunitymagic is the original owner and he is stating to have been defrauded by Wen, he noticed me promptly about that, he showed some proofs and he is goint to notice the police. This is the only reason because I am holding the name because I would not like to have him considering me involved in the fraud if I transfer the name to other person.
However opportunitymagic never said to consider or have nay proofs that Domainp or Opnecg are involved in the fraud and for what I know at this moment there are no evidences they are.

Domainp never explained in details how he got the domain but one possibility is that he bought it from Wen without knowing about the undergoing fraud.

Opencg state to have paid Domainp $3000 for the name and somewhere at sometime Domainp confirmed that.

That for without making any other assumption without evidences to support it the only one being accused of fraud is Wen,
Opportunitymagic lost the domain and a $7500 payment.
Domainp might have lost an amount to buy the domain from Wen but might have received $3000 by Opencg.

Opencg might have lsot $3000 paid to domaimnp.

I lost nothing and hold a domain I do not want.

I highly reccommend the three parties who might have lost the domain and/or money to find an agreement which might fairly compensate each one of them (and then they could eventually also try in get back some money by Wen if at all possible), then let me know to who transfer the domain.

If they need more time to find an arrangement and want me to place the name in a trust account until then I would be glad to do so if they agre and indicate me which account.

Thanks,

[jberryhill]

"JB the lawyer thought a trust account was a good idea - I think you're missing the possibility of things going nasty if a mistake is made in who the name is handed back to. "

And I said that because my eyeballs have not seen either a real person or a real document which is probative of any of the allegations made in the thread. Attilio states that he has seen things which provide him with a firmer belief that this situation is as it appears to be. However, it can be difficult to make decisions on the basis of what story sounds better, or who has a better command of English. Often, people just don't explain things well.

The easy thing for Attilio to have done would have been to hand back the domain name where he got it and walk away. Having restored the status quo in the face of conflicting information, he would have minimized potential exposure.

It seems he has chosen to do something more interesting, and it is good to see that he has learned to use the word "might" to sort out the various possible situations which have been alleged, rather than to assume that anything is necessarily true. He has also clearly stated that his intent is not to claim ownership of the domain name, and is taking action consistent with that intent - hence a claim of fraud, which includes an element of intent, is more difficult to make.

"I read into Mr Berryhills message that the ONLY way"

Just because my limited imagination only comes up with one possibility, does not mean it is the only thing to do. But, yes, if domainp is paid and Allen gets the domain name, then the only person with a gripe would be opencg, and his claim is absurd.

[Attilio]

I am opened to all option and the original owner of the domain stated he is too, I am available to discuss with him, domainp and opencg the best way to solve this matter, including the possibility to have me or the original owner or both together buy back the domain from domainp or opencg.

I continue mentioning opencg because he state to have paid domainp and at a certain poitn domainp confirmed that.

Thanks,


There is an element on confusion yet because

[Attilio]

And I add that if all feel more comfortable I would be entusuait in move the domain to a trust account at godaddy meanwhile an agreement is found. I would be available in pay my part to pay the pesone of common trust who would hold the account.

Thanks

[Mr Webname]

So theft is rewarded?

[Attilio]

Mr Webname,
as it stand it now even the original owner is stating the only one who he has proof might be a theft is those aleged Ben and he will be probably sued in any case by the original owner or at least asked to complete his payment.-