IDN's dropping like flies

[touchring]

Originally Posted by gorilla_bob

Hello Friends,

Looks like you have all been busy since last time I came in here.

Just a quick thought, I can understand the value of IDN, but I don't think alot of the IDN'ers appreciate the value of ASCII or realise that they are arguing how bad ASCII is by using ASCII to express their arguements. Just as a test to see how IDN would not work on a global scale...please IDN'ers...keep to your faith and start arguing in IDN. You'll see just how fast this thread would die.

This entire thread is in ASCII, if we did not all know ASCII or could type ASCII this thread would not exist.

That's all for now, I'll let you all go back to picking at my words again.

Until next time.

- Bob

Acroplex,

Nice to have you back. This thread has not really been an intelectual discussion on ASCII/IDN benefits/detriments but more of a flame war against ASCII vs IDN. Glad at least that I have someone to keep me company.



- Bob

Yes, this is an international domain forum that uses ascii.

There's a chinese domain forum, that's bigger than this forum - please go take a look and tell me how it will lose to an English forum: http://www.domain.cn/club/

Btw, this is the IDN section - http://www.domain.cn/club/forumdisplay.php?fid=2
22750 threads 171376 posts

[DNWizardX9]

Originally Posted by touchring

Yes, this is an international domain forum that uses ascii.

There's a chinese domain forum, that's bigger than this forum - please go take a look and tell me how it will lose to an English forum: http://www.domain.cn/club/

Btw, this is the IDN section - http://www.domain.cn/club/forumdisplay.php?fid=2
22750 threads 171376 posts

I don't think bob can read it. Remember, he believes that all the Chinese speak english.

[touchring]

That's not an issue, here's the Google translated link -
http://translate.google.com/translat...language_tools

Now he can try to read chinese like a chinese reads english.

[Raider]

Is there anyone on this forum that posted traffic stats for generic IDN dot coms? Save the "IDN's are the future & traffic will only increase" Post some current stats, I'd like see them.

[touchring]

Originally Posted by Raider

Is there anyone on this forum that posted traffic stats for generic IDN dot coms? Save the "IDN's are the future & traffic will only increase" Post some current stats, I'd like see them.

Nobody post stats unless they are selling the name. Will you?

If you check on IDNF, there might be a few, but they are rare and are mostly SEO minisites with mostly SE traffic.

Another source is Sedo, which shows traffic, but you must know how to find the IDNs.

[Raider]

Originally Posted by touchring

Nobody post stats unless they are selling the name. Will you?

If I was trying to prove a point, YES I would! Make a believer out of me, post stats of your best generic IDN, it would be interesting to see.

[DNWizardX9]

Originally Posted by Raider

Is there anyone on this forum that posted traffic stats for generic IDN dot coms? Save the "IDN's are the future & traffic will only increase" Post some current stats, I'd like see them.

probably more traffic than your own domains since I doubt you own premium traffic names.

[bwhhisc]

Originally Posted by Raider

If I was trying to prove a point, YES I would! Make a believer out of me, post stats of your best generic IDN, it would be interesting to see.

Overall there is not much traffic to IDNs (yet) but that will change dramatically when browser support gets in place. IE7 which supports IDNs has not rolled out in Asia since being held back by Microsoft. They are currently saying it will be released in current 3rd quarter.

Regarding stats, one of the best examples is on the homepage of namedrive.com is a Thai language idn for sale (porno.com) getting 5000-6000 plus hits a month and earning about $35 per month currently. Thai domains are currently low paying per click, versus Japanese which average 10x higher overall. Google, Yahoo, Baidu etc are all positioning themselves into the IDN advertising market.

[Raider]

Originally Posted by DNWizardX9

probably more traffic than your own domains since I doubt you own premium traffic names.

I do own quite a few traffic domains, but that's irrelevant to what I'm asking, and of course you know that, Were talking about IDN's here, I'm not the one pumping IDN's with a lot of talk and no beef, if IDN's are being used, you should have a decent type-in rate for good generics wouldn't you?. So do you care to share?

Originally Posted by bwhhisc

Regarding stats, one of the best examples is on the homepage of namedrive.com is a Thai language idn for sale (porno.com) getting 5000-6000 plus hits a month and earning about $35 per month currently.

Thanks for posting something with substance, May I ask why the revenue is so low for 5000-6000 hits? ... I own an adult generic .com with 4000 hits a month and I'm earning over $300 a month from that name alone.

If you can post a snapshot, I would appreciate it.

[BILLBO]

Hi Raider,

It is the payout from the parking company most probably! The few adult domains I have are now earning a massive 0.02 Euros per click through Sedo, this is why development is the longterm key. But I digress.

Bwhhisc did say that he was earning low because of the source of the traffic (Thai) and gave a comparrison on earnings as being only 1/10th of that of Japanese traffic.

IDN's are a 'natural' source of traffic as soon as the system is up and running, sure you will not get American or other English language hits, but with the billions of people who have a local written non-latin language they are a very big potential niche of the overall market place.

[touchring]

Originally Posted by bwhhisc

Overall there is not much traffic to IDNs (yet) but that will change dramatically when browser support gets in place. IE7 which supports IDNs has not rolled out in Asia since being held back by Microsoft. They are currently saying it will be released in current 3rd quarter.

Regarding stats, one of the best examples is on the homepage of namedrive.com is a Thai language idn for sale (porno.com) getting 5000-6000 plus hits a month and earning about $35 per month currently. Thai domains are currently low paying per click, versus Japanese which average 10x higher overall. Google, Yahoo, Baidu etc are all positioning themselves into the IDN advertising market.

It is true that most IDNs don't get much traffic. The fact that they get any natural traffic at all is itself amazing, since there are practically no real websites using IDN for URL - since most browsers do not support IDN, and many people don't even know IDNs exist. Even this forum itself, 99% of people don't think IDNs are domains!

Nonetheless there do are IDNs that get a few hundred type-ins a day traffic and traffic is increasing. But i must emphasize that these are very rare, and probably these are the ones that will get tens of thousands of views a day by the time IDNs go mainstream - like super ASCII names, sex.com, download.com, etc. So don't expect people with these names to show you stats!!

[DNWizardX9]

Originally Posted by Raider

I do own quite a few traffic domains, but that's irrelevant to what I'm asking, and of course you know that, Were talking about IDN's here, I'm not the one pumping IDN's with a lot of talk and no beef, if IDN's are being used, you should have a decent type-in rate for good generics wouldn't you?. So do you care to share?



Thanks for posting something with substance, May I ask why the revenue is so low for 5000-6000 hits? ... I own an adult generic .com with 4000 hits a month and I'm earning over $300 a month from that name alone.

If you can post a snapshot, I would appreciate it.

google is still entering the thai market and recruiting more advertisers... expect this market to pick up in due time.

[wrdekle]

Originally Posted by Raider

If I was trying to prove a point, YES I would! Make a believer out of me, post stats of your best generic IDN, it would be interesting to see.

I can show you depending on whether you care if the traffic came from type-in or SE as long as the traffic is "free"? It is too early for much type-in traffic to asian IDNs, about 1% of my traffic is type-in on Japanese IDNs most come from good placement with search engines.

[touchring]

Originally Posted by DNWizardX9

google is still entering the thai market and recruiting more advertisers... expect this market to pick up in due time.

I think Raider wants to know the facts. The fact is that unless you got top tier IDNs, there is little direct traffic.

IDN is not like ASCII where there are lots of traffic generated by typos, similar websites, expired traffic from names with links all over the web, getting PR from those links, and etc, etc. You guys will know better than me!

Generally, you can't expect traffic if:
1. 90% of browsers in Asia can't access IDNs.
2. There are almost no websites that use IDNs (discounting minisites).
3. 99% of people don't know IDNs exist.

The truth is that IDN is a waiting game and will be a waiting game for years to come. And most people on DNF don't like to wait, everyone wants immediate income. Buy domains with expired traffic and earn the next 12 months, never mind if the traffic keeps reducing and disappears finally. Or pump up the landrush for a new TLD like .mobi and then sell to newbies that haven't got a clue -quick money in 6 months - these guys are now swearing away, many quietly since no one wants to advertise his folly.

There is a long wait ahead - IE7 has negligible marketshare in Asia, and Firefox is a minor player.

But for those who are willing to wait, especially those that waited since 2001 or 2005, even early 2006, the results will be very rewarding once the momentum picks up in year 201x.

IDN prices has gradually gone up as steadily as times go by. When i purchased a major chinese city (tier one) idn for 2 grand back in Jan 2006, it was like a crazy price and i got a feeling it was the record price for chinese idn then. Now, i doubt anyone will sell a tier one chinese city .COM for less than 5 figures.

For those who think that the chance to buy IDNs will come when there is a dot mobi like crash, it will probably never happen. Why?

1). The thing about IDN is that traffic is increasing steadily over months since most IDNs are .COMs.

2). Domain renewal cost is low (most people only register premium names and don't waste money like many of those compound word dot mobis - because they know they have to renew at least a few times).

The market is drying up as we speak when "investors" secretly suck out the prime names and put them into cold storage - some intend to save them for their kids!

3). People that really spend money to buy IDNs generally believe it is a long term investment. If you invest $1000, renewing for 10 years for $70 isn't that difficult thing to do.

4). The dollar is weakening and your purchase power would have diminished so much 10 years from now, you will need to spend more dollars to buy IDNs in the future. Over the medium term, this will offset any possible market induced depreciation in IDN prices even if there will be a recession.

5). Prime names once bought over by deep pocket investors will be gone from the market for good. A lot of them are already gone, if not the majority.

6). Without influence and market manipulation from big boys or domain syndicates (you know who they are) and registrars, IDN is the closest thing we have to a gradually appreciating real investment, at least for the domaining world.


Ok, enough of beating around the bush, i'll be more direct:

If you live on a current account only, IDN is not for you!

[bwhhisc]

Originally Posted by Raider

Thanks for posting something with substance, May I ask why the revenue is so low for 5000-6000 hits? ... I own an adult generic .com with 4000 hits a month and I'm earning over $300 a month from that name alone. If you can post a snapshot, I would appreciate it.

Hi Raider, that name is not mine...but was a good example and verifiable since Namedrive is posting the statistics off their system and it is posted under their park & sell on their home page.

My best steady PPC performer is "Classmates.com" in Russian which earns about $10 - $12 a month, still not bad for a $7 a year investment. PPC is currently low in many languages, but again these markets are just developing for advertising and revenues and they will (hopefully) increase over time along with traffic and typeins.

July 2007 month to date- Classmates.com (Russian)
одноклассники(dot)com US$ 9.24 revenue 857 hits 522 clicks 61% ctr, US $ 0.02

Not impressive traffic by ASCII standards, but potential to go up 10x to 100x down the road,
or better yet I hope to find a buyer at minimum selling price in the xx,xxx range someday.

Some notes: Currently less than 10% of Russia internet users can access IDNs so traffic is weak.
The same in China, Japan etc. Finally, after a long wait (remember most top IDN keywords were
registered in year 2000), all of the pieces of the IDN system are about to be realized.
(1) The ICANN unicode/punycode system for idns is in place, tested and working
(2) monetization and parking is now provided by companies like Namedrive, Yahoo, and Google
(3) FINALLY...we will get the critical last piece of the puzzle this year... which is Browser
support by Microsoft IE7 and Vista.

IDN should still be considered a speculative investment but a lot of the unknowns a year ago
are known now. There is massive registration by native domainers and companies so it looks
pretty good for the future from our research and reading. On the conservative side I would
not recommend IDN to anyone who can not wait it out and be patient. For those that do,
the ROI on your investment may be exceptional.

[touchring]

Originally Posted by bwhhisc

July 2007 month to date- Classmates.com (Russian)
одноклассники.com US$ 9.24 revenue 857 hits 522 clicks 61% ctr, US $ 0.02

Hey, you sure you did not make out those figures? How can Russian.com got traffic in the first place!! Who the hell will type in Russian одноклассники, and then add the .com, let alone 857 people!?

[bwhhisc]

Originally Posted by touchring

Hey, you sure you did not make out those figures? How can Russian.com got traffic in the first place!! Who the hell will type in Russian одноклассники, and then add the .com, let alone 857 people!?

If I was going to make something up it sure wouldn't be saying that my best domain
revenue produces $10 bucks a month! LOL

This is all about the future, my friend!

Kind of a parallel to being a domainer back in 1997 with all the knowledge of 2007.
Many see the future of the internet globally to have URLs in international languages.
It may prove to be a huge opportunity for those who take the chance.

[touchring]

This against common sense!

[filter]

(ooops - posted in the wrong thread - sorry!)

[DNWizardX9]

no good idns droppin lately