Is this Ebay tatic illegal?

**jag5311** · 11-04-2002, 08:30 PM

I am not sure if that is the proper question to ask, but is Ebay's only purpose to act as an auction and simply get a highest bidder in contact with the seller. The reason I ask, is I was thinking that if someone wanted to, especially in the domain industry, a seller could ask a friend to make a high bid, but under the reserve (kinda like shill bidding), and even if the auction was won by the friend, there is no obligation between the seller and his friend to complete the transfer, if they didn't want to. Like the transfer of ownership for a domain. Is this tatic used quite a bit on ebay, and is it illegal? I ask that because payments can be made in many different forms, and Ebay doesn't have to know whether or not a transaction took place

Thanks in advanced

bryan

**draqon** · 11-04-2002, 08:34 PM

shill bidding is illegal, i believe. therefore what you are describing is indeed illegal. im sure that goes on at ebay ALL the time, probably half the items there have some fake bids.

**jag5311** · 11-04-2002, 08:42 PM

Thanks. What I really want to know, though, is whether or not a transaction HAS to take place between the seller and buyer, or is that something that is just assumed. I could just see two people using a method where they try to draw in more bidders with more money, and if it doesn't work, then they say have a nice night and we will try it again later. I mean, just because EBAY tells the buyer, your auction is over, the highest bidder is BLAH, does that signify that buyer and seller MUST make contact and solidify the deal.

Thanks
bryan

**Lord Baltimore** · 11-04-2002, 09:13 PM

My advice is to never, never, never make a bid on eBay unless you intend to buy something. Shill bidding is not only illegal--but it will cost you your reputation in the eyes of the big shots on the net.

**draqon** · 11-04-2002, 09:15 PM

Ebay auctions are a legal form of a contract. Contracts bind both parties, unless both parties agree the contract is null and void. So the winner and his friend could decide not to complete the sale and this would not be a problem. However, they would still be responsible for paying Ebay's listing fees and completion fees.

**bidawinner** · 11-04-2002, 09:16 PM

Never never never..ditto Lord B..never never never..

You'd be suprised how often they actually catch people too..
You'd also be suprised at the idiots that get by with it..well at least for awhile..

**Togoodhlth** · 11-04-2002, 09:26 PM

Shill bidding must be pretty hard to prove so I would imagine it is common however I can't state that as a matter of fact.
Ebay should put some sort of warning on the home page with regard to shill bidding and the legal ramifications if caught.

**adoptabledomains** · 11-05-2002, 12:11 AM

Originally posted by Togoodhlth
Shill bidding must be pretty hard to prove so I would imagine it is common however I can't state that as a matter of fact.
Ebay should put some sort of warning on the home page with regard to shill bidding and the legal ramifications if caught.

First, it's against ebay rules.

Second, if the shill bid did take place the seller would still have to pay the listing and seller fees.

Third, you'll likely get a bad reputation and banned.

Fourth, it would be pretty easy to prove the shill if the domain never transferred since whois records are accessible bay any of the losing bidders, ebay, and authorities if actually illegal.

Fifth, everyone who registers with ebay has agreed to the rules which specifically state shill bidding is not allowed or tolerated.

Ebay's whole business is based on the reliance that bids are on the up and up. Don't think they won't do everything to protect that and havn't seen and stopped just about anything you can think of before.

**jag5311** · 11-05-2002, 12:21 AM

very good explanation. Thanks

**DomainPairs** · 11-05-2002, 07:16 PM

in the auction world shill bidding is not illegal unless you have a reserve price. Shill bidding is against the rules of Ebay.
You can withdraw from a completed sale if both parties agree to the withdrawal in which case the final value fee is refunded.

**Drewbert** · 11-05-2002, 10:15 PM

What's the best way to contact someone at eBay when the SELLER of a domain name decides to back out AFTER the auction has ended?

**Shiftlock** · 11-05-2002, 10:23 PM

Ebay recommends trying to resolve disputes by using SquareTrade, "eBayâ€™s preferred dispute resolution provider." Read about it and file a complaint here.

Don't forget to post negative feedback on the seller if you can't work things out.

**DomainPairs** · 11-06-2002, 02:58 AM

Square Trade and Ebay are a waste of space if the seller backs out. The only thing you can do is to neg him and then go into protracted mailings with Ebay to get the retaliatory neg removed.
If he gets 3 complaints he can get banned and has to get re-registered in a new name so he can carry on doing it.

**Drewbert** · 11-06-2002, 07:41 PM

Yes, that Squaretrade looks like it'd be a waste of time in this case.

I think I'll just embarrass him in public until he decides he's better off completing the deal and transfering the name to us.

He's the head honcho of an NY Volvo dealership, so I'm sure all his potential customers will be interested to hear of what he thinks of contractual obligations.