Need REAL ways to avoid spiders for the domains

[james2002]

I know that you provide solutions to avoid the spiders crawling the domain names in the forums.

But those solutions do not work.

e.g.

For example, I saw a domain AUinvestorsDOTcom in appraisal section.

The member used the technique you provide to avoid spiders.

But here is the thread which appears in 2nd place in google for the exact domain.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...G=Search&meta=


If a potential buyer see the thread, he or she might not want to go for more than $300 for that domain .


So the ways you provide to avoid spiders do not work.


We like to have a REAL way to avoid spiders if we want. You may consider making this feature availabe to all members or just exclusive members.


thanks

[biggedon]

Hi

here's my personal, "non-moderator opinion"

publicity and exposure is good for your domain!

some of you members who complain about spiders and all that need to quit it.

in reality, most of the domains you're trying to hide ain't worth all that

and in fact, they probably need all the exposure they can get!


i've seen some of the sorriest names being posted for both appraisal and for sale and the OP tries to camouflage the name in the title.


do you really think the past owners of prominent domain sales cared whether or not their name got indexed, botted or spidered?

hell no, because in the end, they are only going to sell if the price is right.

and that's the confidence you gotta have or learn to get/show when trying to sell or responding to offers.



don't keep blaming the forum and title qualifications for your failure to get the most for your domains.

imnmo..

[liberator]

I agree Biggedon, but it does hurt negotiations if the buyer points to thread x and says it was for sale for $100 x months ago and now you want 3k or similar. Thats the only downside I have had with domains being indexed

[biggedon]

Originally Posted by liberator

I agree Biggedon, but it does hurt negotiations if the buyer points to thread x and says it was for sale for $100 x months ago and now you want 3k or similar. Thats the only downside I have had with domains being indexed

you don't have to post a fixed price here or bin. so there wouldn't be any old threads to point to a price.


also, why continue to negotiate with someone who wants to argue your price?

either you settle for what they're willing to pay or you move on.

[jaydub]

As far as I see it ...this has been an issue raised many many times here.
As a forum with paid members I think this should be a wake-up call that it is of concern to many here who may or may not be as wise or enlightened as biggedon and therefore it should be an issue that the forum should seriously consider....and/or care about.

If this was an annual membership renewal forum, I humbly suggest it would be seriously considered/listened to....but our money is in the bank.

No one has asked anyone to change any programming or add a hack or break any laws. Just don't make it mandatory for a name in the title. Those that choose to put names in the title could continue to do so. And those that choose NOT to click on threads with no name in the title could exercise that right as well.

Many members have told you they have concerns about it and yet all that seems to fall on deaf ears each and every time, and they get ridiculed/chastised for having that opinion.

I rarely bother to even participate in these any more as it always comes down to the same result but it does get frustrating seeing the same record getting played over and over.

I'll probably get flamed to he-double hockey sticks....
Good luck in your adventure james2002 and peace all,

j

Originally Posted by biggedon

you don't have to post a fixed price here or bin. so there wouldn't be any old threads to point to a price.


also, why continue to negotiate with someone who wants to argue your price?

either you settle for what they're willing to pay or you move on.

Originally Posted by biggedon

Hi

here's my personal, "non-moderator opinion"

publicity and exposure is good for your domain!

some of you members who complain about spiders and all that need to quit it.

in reality, most of the domains you're trying to hide ain't worth all that

and in fact, they probably need all the exposure they can get!


i've seen some of the sorriest names being posted for both appraisal and for sale and the OP tries to camouflage the name in the title.


do you really think the past owners of prominent domain sales cared whether or not their name got indexed, botted or spidered?

hell no, because in the end, they are only going to sell if the price is right.

and that's the confidence you gotta have or learn to get/show when trying to sell or responding to offers.



don't keep blaming the forum and title qualifications for your failure to get the most for your domains.

imnmo..

[randomo]

I fully agree. It should be each person's choice whether or not to post domain names in a way that can be spidered.

Biggedon, all respect to you ... but just because you think it's good to maximize publicity on a domain, that doesn't mean everyone thinks that way. I would post more good domains for sale here if I didn't have to fear those posts showing up in Google. (I offer domains to both resellers and end users, and I don't want end users seeing my reseller offers.)

[biggedon]

Originally Posted by jaydub

As far as I see it ...this has been an issue raised many many times here.
As a forum with paid members I think this should be a wake-up call that it is of concern to many here who may or may not be as wise or enlightened as biggedon and therefore it should be an issue that the forum should seriously consider....and/or care about.

If this was an annual membership renewal forum, I humbly suggest it would be seriously considered/listened to....but our money is in the bank.

No one has asked anyone to change any programming or add a hack or break any laws. Just don't make it mandatory for a name in the title. Those that choose to put names in the title could continue to do so. And those that choose NOT to click on threads with no name in the title could exercise that right as well.

Many members have told you they have concerns about it and yet all that seems to fall on deaf ears each and every time, and they get ridiculed/chastised for having that opinion.

I rarely bother to even participate in these any more as it always comes down to the same result but it does get frustrating seeing the same record getting played over and over.

I'll probably get flamed to he-double hockey sticks....
Good luck in your adventure james2002 and peace all,

j

my personal, "non-moderator opinion"



there are many who come here and all they want to do is change rules and have new sub-forums, and their only motive is for doing it is for themselves.

this is not an annual renewal forum, so why the "If"?

since you don't know what the "If" scenerio would be either

sure it's a paid membership, but you only pay once!

you pay to join the forum as is, you don't pay to try and cause chaos and make everything go your way cause you can't sell a domain.

your desire to join and be accepted to this forum does not entitle you to constantly challenge staff's actions or decisions.

sure, you are entitled to make suggestions, but when those suggestions do not have an overall benefit to the forum and it's membership as a whole, then they may not be worthy of consideration.

you also have to look at who is making the suggestion and who is just jumping on the bandwagon, because they too have crap names and wanna hide them as well or the particular suggestion thread fits an issue where they just wanna raise hell.

imo...the majority of members have no problem with domain in title requirements, it's just a few regulars (less than 10) who start threads here and look for someone to agree with them.

if you don't care to participate, then that's on you. however the results are not always the same.

* members asked for a General Discussion section, we gave it to them, now everyone forgets about the Gold cafe and Platinum lounge

* members asked for cctld sections; we gave it to them
* members asked for .mobi gltd section, we gave it to them

now it's hard to get members to post their cctlds/.mobi in those sections


* members asked for a Geo domain section: we gave them that, then they started posting any kind of crapola name there.


* so we gave them a sub-fourm to that section...which now gives you more areas to post in!


* members asked for a sedo "push to auction" section starting at $60.

we gave them that...now you see people posting there wanting to start bids off at $300

it's not always the same result when members ask for improvements or additions, but it's usually the same result when it comes to conforming to posting rules for these newly created sections.

but how many members are starting any suggestion threads, asking other members to please read and follow the rules.

show me how much you support the efforts of the forum and staff before you keep trying to change it to fit your ideals.

imo...

[james2002]

Biggedon, I have sold quite a few domains in low to mid xxxx over past few weeks. I seriously believe if I put them in the platinum forum and got indexed, many forumers here would only bid mid xx or maximum low xxx. If potential buyers see those threads, I would not have sold xxxx range. You would notice I rarely post my domains in platinum forums for this issue but mostly in exclusive forum.

There are times when I decided not to buy certain domains as I noticed the sellers just bought for xx and would like to sell xxx or xxxx. I usually google the domain names before I buy them.

End users recently surprised me by paying many multiples of the money I paid. That's why I seriously believe it would be helpful if there is PROPER means of avoiding spiders as the means the forum put in the RULES do not work.

If you like to get exposure for your names, that's fine. But for those who don't like to get spiders to crawl, there should be REAL means to avoid them.

[jaydub]

wow....so because someone asks for something they are "challenging"

Hey don...whatever...take things personally if you want.

I have never set out to cause/create an overthrow/revolution of this forum.
I go about my business here quietly and professionally but the odd time I step in to support someone's.

Whether I agree with the rules or not I follow them. I don't just decide something is wrong and do things my way. In other words the fact that I might think we shouldn't have a domain name in the title doesn't mean I just post without one. I try and follow the rules as laid out by this forum. Simple.

If I have a rules suggestion I will make it. If change is implemented...great. If not...my life goes on either way...

I treat this forum and it's members and staff...and any others I am a member at ....with respect...and always have.
If I felt that any forum had treated me or other members in an egregious manner I would just move on. I don't think I have intimated that in any way.

Whatever you guys decide will be the ultimate rule.
I simply stepped in with an opinion/view/observation. And I am OK with that.

No need to continue this any further...it's just getting ugly.

Have a great day all...

Originally Posted by biggedon

my personal, "non-moderator opinion"



there are many who come here and all they want to do is change rules and have new sub-forums, and their only motive is for doing it is for themselves.

this is not an annual renewal forum, so why the "If"?

since you don't know what the "If" scenerio would be either

sure it's a paid membership, but you only pay once!

you pay to join the forum as is, you don't pay to try and cause chaos and make everything go your way cause you can't sell a domain.

your desire to join and be accepted to this forum does not entitle you to constantly challenge staff's actions or decisions.

sure, you are entitled to make suggestions, but when those suggestions do not have an overall benefit to the forum and it's membership as a whole, then they may not be worthy of consideration.

you also have to look at who is making the suggestion and who is just jumping on the bandwagon, because they too have crap names and wanna hide them as well or the particular suggestion thread fits an issue where they just wanna raise hell.

imo...the majority of members have no problem with domain in title requirements, it's just a few regulars (less than 10) who start threads here and look for someone to agree with them.

if you don't care to participate, then that's on you. however the results are not always the same.

* members asked for a General Discussion section, we gave it to them, now everyone forgets about the Gold cafe and Platinum lounge

* members asked for cctld sections; we gave it to them
* members asked for .mobi gltd section, we gave it to them

now it's hard to get members to post their cctlds/.mobi in those sections


* members asked for a Geo domain section: we gave them that, then they started posting any kind of crapola name there.


* so we gave them a sub-fourm to that section...which now gives you more areas to post in!


* members asked for a sedo "push to auction" section starting at $60.

we gave them that...now you see people posting there wanting to start bids off at $300

it's not always the same result when members ask for improvements or additions, but it's usually the same result when it comes to conforming to posting rules for these newly created sections.

but how many members are starting any suggestion threads, asking other members to please read and follow the rules.

show me how much you support the efforts of the forum and staff before you keep trying to change it to fit your ideals.

imo...

[biggedon]

Originally Posted by james2002

Biggedon, I have sold quite a few domains in low to mid xxxx over past few weeks. I seriously believe if I put them in the platinum forum and got indexed, many forumers here would only bid mid xx or maximum low xxx. If potential buyers see those threads, I would not have sold xxxx range. You would notice I rarely post my domains in platinum forums for this issue but mostly in exclusive forum.

There are times when I decided not to buy certain domains as I noticed the sellers just bought for xx and would like to sell xxx or xxxx. I usually google the domain names before I buy them.

End users recently surprised me by paying many multiples of the money I paid. That's why I seriously believe it would be helpful if there is PROPER means of avoiding spiders as the means the forum put in the RULES do not work.

If you like to get exposure for your names, that's fine. But for those who don't like to get spiders to crawl, there should be REAL means to avoid them.

i could fall for what you say, if i didn't know better....but i do

you are exclusive member and can post in exclusive section, where no title is required, so what point can you make....really?

what you believe would happen if you posted your names in Platinum section and if they got indexed is irrelevant, because you can post there without including a price.

if you don't buy a domain because it was recently regged at a certain price, then that's because you decided it wasn't worth that much.

it didn't have anything to to do with when it was regged or where it was previously posted.

and if end-users surprised you in how much they are willing to pay, it's only because maybe you didn't know how much you could actually get for the domain!

i have sold names within 30 days of registration for $,$$$, and none of the buyers ever asked when it was registered...they just wanted the domain.


post some actual emails/pm's/phone conversations/msn messages where you actually lost a sale because an end-user pointed to a current or previous priced sales thread here on dnf.

imo...

[james2002]

You are trying to defend what is indefensible.

You put the wrong means in the RULES of the forum stating by applying them, we could avoid spider crawling. We are trying to stress to replace those wrong means with workable ones to avoid spider crawling.

I am not competing with an experienced domainer like yourself in selling domains. I believe I am still a learner and domain world is too wide and could not stop learning.

[kamil]

Originally Posted by biggedon

imo...the majority of members have no problem with domain in title requirements, it's just a few regulars (less than 10) who start threads here and look for someone to agree with them.

Lets have a poll? Just wondering how did You form this opinion that majority of members don't have any problem with this? What if they just don't expect any change so decided to gave up even talking about it?

Why not a poll on this issue?

[mjnels]

i dont like the domain in title rule... seems silly and pointless especially when you are selling several or 100's of domains in the same thread.

what is the actual point behind the "1 name in title" rule anyway?

[biggedon]

Hey don...whatever...take things personally if you want.

to jaydub:

it's not personal

been here since 2002 and been posting names for sale with name in title for years and never had the issues you guys complain about.

Originally Posted by kamil

Lets have a poll? Just wondering how did You form this opinion that majority of members don't have any problem with this? What if they just don't expect any change so decided to gave up even talking about it?

Why not a poll on this issue?

you know...polling can be a good way to get an idea of what members think, but then again, do you want to run your forum as a democracy?

do you want every suggestion to be decided by a poll?

i'm sure if we had a poll asking does everyone wanna post as many threads as they want with no restrictions, the majority who participate may say yes.

though the "silent majority" may not participate or even care.

so in essence you would have a minority of members making decisions for the majority.


if we have 35,000 members and only 50 respond to the poll, and then only 26 say yes, change the rules....would we be acting in the best interst of the total membership or just a select few?


or maybe some jerk member who has a following here decides he wants to be mod, so someone starts a suggestion thread.

then we have a poll and 25 members say, yeah make the jerk mod
but 24 members say no and 10 vote for someone else.

then we make the jerk a mod and he starts closing all your threads and gives infractions for no reason.

then you start a suggestion thread and a poll to have him removed, but not enough people vote him out...so your stuck.

now that's an out-the-box scenerio, but that's what could happen if you agree to make decisions based on poll results.

imo...

[randomo]

Originally Posted by biggedon

been here since 2002 and been posting names for sale with name in title for years and never had the issues you guys complain about.

Well, I've also been here since 2002, and those issues matter to me!

I would rather not have to post domain names in thread titles. (I also don't want to be restricted to having only Exclusive members see my posts, or prevented from listing prices in my posts.) But if we must post domain names in titles, please note James2002's comment:

"You put the wrong means in the RULES of the forum stating by applying them, we could avoid spider crawling. We are trying to stress to replace those wrong means with workable ones to avoid spider crawling."

So that seems like an obvious compromise. Keep requiring domains in titles if you must, but follow the spirit of the existing rule by letting us post the names in a truly non-spiderable format.

[Leading Names]

Originally Posted by kamil

Lets have a poll? Just wondering how did You form this opinion that majority of members don't have any problem with this? What if they just don't expect any change so decided to gave up even talking about it?

Why not a poll on this issue?

Seconded. My guess would be that over 80% would vote against allowing spiders to crawl sales/appraisal threads.

Indexed sales threads cause many problems for the domain owner...

Legal: Many examples exist where someone put up a name for an appraisal, only for that appraisal to come back and bite him/her in UDRP. Same with sales threads.

Prices: Difficult to increase prices e.g. I post example.com for sales at $999 here on the forums. Someone then approaches me a year later via Sedo or Email, I quote a price of $5000 and they come back and say "but you listed it for sale here at $999".

Etc etc.

Let's have a poll – even if you don't listen to the results, would be fun

- Rob

[copper]

Savvy buyers (endusers or not, domainers or not) DO check Google about the domain they want to buy.

I do agree it's harder to sell at wanted price if there is past sold price that potential buyer can compare.
It's just common sense.

[QUOTE=Leading Names;1720920]
Let's have a poll – even if you don't listen to the results, would be fun
- Rob[/QOTE]

For what purpose?
We already know the result

[kamil]

Originally Posted by biggedon

you know...polling can be a good way to get an idea of what members think, but then again, do you want to run your forum as a democracy?

do you want every suggestion to be decided by a poll?

i'm sure if we had a poll asking does everyone wanna post as many threads as they want with no restrictions, the majority who participate may say yes.

though the "silent majority" may not participate or even care.

so in essence you would have a minority of members making decisions for the majority.


if we have 35,000 members and only 50 respond to the poll, and then only 26 say yes, change the rules....would we be acting in the best interst of the total membership or just a select few?


or maybe some jerk member who has a following here decides he wants to be mod, so someone starts a suggestion thread.

then we have a poll and 25 members say, yeah make the jerk mod
but 24 members say no and 10 vote for someone else.

then we make the jerk a mod and he starts closing all your threads and gives infractions for no reason.

then you start a suggestion thread and a poll to have him removed, but not enough people vote him out...so your stuck.

now that's an out-the-box scenerio, but that's what could happen if you agree to make decisions based on poll results.

imo...

Well, there used to be democracy on this forum, as I remember once upon a time forum admin created a poll in order to decide about 'Should Teens 17 and under be allowed to do business- Cast your vote now.'

Democracy link

[biggedon]

Originally Posted by randomo

Well, I've also been here since 2002, and those issues matter to me!

I would rather not have to post domain names in thread titles. (I also don't want to be restricted to having only Exclusive members see my posts, or prevented from listing prices in my posts.) But if we must post domain names in titles, please note James2002's comment:

"You put the wrong means in the RULES of the forum stating by applying them, we could avoid spider crawling. We are trying to stress to replace those wrong means with workable ones to avoid spider crawling."

So that seems like an obvious compromise. Keep requiring domains in titles if you must, but follow the spirit of the existing rule by letting us post the names in a truly non-spiderable format.

maybe we didn't put the wrong means of blocking spiders from crawling threads....maybe the spiders adapted and evolved, like viruses, and they can now see what they couldn't see before.

why don't you guys go and "find' some other means to put the domain in the title and still block it from spiders?

since it's your suggestion, then come up with a solution...without changing the basic rule.

Originally Posted by Leading Names

Seconded. My guess would be that over 80% would vote against allowing spiders to crawl sales/appraisal threads.

Indexed sales threads cause many problems for the domain owner...

Legal: Many examples exist where someone put up a name for an appraisal, only for that appraisal to come back and bite him/her in UDRP. Same with sales threads.

Prices: Difficult to increase prices e.g. I post example.com for sales at $999 here on the forums. Someone then approaches me a year later via Sedo or Email, I quote a price of $5000 and they come back and say "but you listed it for sale here at $999".

Etc etc.

Let's have a poll – even if you don't listen to the results, would be fun

- Rob

Hi Rob

you're only co-signing the same "what if" scenerio that was mentioned before.

how about providing some proven examples of where it affected your sales, because you posted a domain on this forum.

Originally Posted by copper

Savvy buyers (endusers or not, domainers or not) DO check Google about the domain they want to buy.

I do agree it's harder to sell at wanted price if there is past sold price that potential buyer can compare.
It's just common sense.

Originally Posted by Leading Names

Let's have a poll – even if you don't listen to the results, would be fun
- Rob[/QOTE]

For what purpose?
We already know the result

savvy buyers also know that they may have to pay the asking price of the seller, if they want the domain.

as savvy sellers often know the value and are willing to hold a domain until the right price comes along.


in the end, the decision is not mine to make. as i am only giving my personal opinion

though until enough people show examples of actual experiences where this issue has affected/effected the sale to an end-user, then i couldn't support it unless members come up with a viable alternative to the current means that are in place now.

[james2002]

why don't you guys go and "find' some other means to put the domain in the title and still block it from spiders?

since it's your suggestion, then come up with a solution...without changing the basic rule.

I know one possible solution.

When I post in platinum forum, I post like ExampleDOTcom . So far spiders or spiderman or spiderwoman could not index it as example.com .

But my threads got locked and the reason was because it was not proper titile format.

It was a solution. I appreciate if we could post like that. It would not change the rule but ENCHANCE or CORRECT the rules set by the forums.