RMF

This is bit of a strange situation. Its a little long, so I understand if you don't read it

Also, I used fake terms/names like "hotmail.com", "example.com", and "bob" a lot instead of using the real info. As you can probably understand why.

Well, here we go....

I was contacted late last week about a domain I own, however, I wasn’t home. Let’s call the domain “example.com”. Its not really “example.com”. I then called back a couple hours later, and left a message with his wife or daughter of this guy who is contacting me. Let’s call him “Bob”. “Bob” doesn’t call me back, and he doesn’t even email me. Now, lets pretend my email in the whois is rmf@hotmail.com (real email not @hotmail.com, but is also a free email provider). “Bob” went and contacted the owner of “hotmail.com” and basically got the owners “hotmail.com” involved with all of this, and what im about to talk about shortly. Lastnight, the owner of “hotmail.com” calls me to discuss this situation. A situtation that I really knew nothing about since I haven’t spoke with “Bob” as of yet. So now I basically learn what “Bob” wants through the owner of “hotmail.com” which really made no sense at all. There was no point at all to bring the owner of “hotmail.com” into this situation, as they had nothing to do with it. Now that the owners of “hotmail.com” are involved, they’re worried that they will face legal action, even though I know this can’t happen. Afterall, they didn’t own the domain or have any real connection to it. But still and all, they’re still worried. This also makes me a little mad because it creates problems for me with them (the owners of “hotmail.com”). I feel like the bad guy here, and I didn’t do anything wrong. I registered the domain. I didn’t steal it!

After I got off the phone with the owners of “hotmail.com”, I contacted “Bob” by email. I then called “Bob” in the morning to deal with this ASAP. “Bob” then tells me that “example.com” use to be his. “Bob” then says he just found out that his company didn’t own it anymore. Here is where it gets a little weird. “example.com” expired in or before February of 2003. I registered “example.com” in May. Its now July and hes only now realizing he doesn’t own it anymore. Of course, he is blaming his employees for not keeping his whois information correct, and Network Solutions for not telling him to renew “example.com”. The email “Bob” used for the adminstrative contact in the whois had expired a long time ago. In fact it was registered by another company in March of 2000. What I learned here is that he had at least 2 years to update his email address to receive renewal notifications. He failed to do this. I also realized today which I also explained to him that his main domain name that he still uses, uses the same email he used for “example.com”. So, he obviously can’t manage his domains very well.

Ok, now I hope I didn’t confuse you too much with that.

When I spoke with him on the phone this morning, he said he wanted the domain back. He wanted me to say a price. I refused, and told him to email me his offer. He suggested over the phone that he might also be willing to trade domains for it as he owns several domains. I told him to include any domains he thinks he would like trade with his offer.

When I got his “offer” it did not have anything about any possible domain trade. He gave me a very low offer of $100 and cost of transfer, which wouldn’t even cover my cost in registering this domain. He also included some excuses as to why he lost the domain.

I replied with a nice letter. Here is basically what I said:

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“Bob”,

I'm sorry but your offer isn't acceptable. Your offer wouldn't justify me selling it. I have spent more than what you offered to register the domain name. This doesn't include the time I spent or the fact that it is a great domain name. The domain is an important domain to me as I intended to develop it. The fact is your employees failed to keep your domain whois information up-to-date, which resulted in the expiration and deletion of the domain name. I have decided to ask $3000 for the domain name. "example.com" is worth a lot more to me, but I also don't want to appear unreasonable. Had you not been the previous owner of this domain, I wouldn't sell it.

I would also like to make it clear that “hotmail.com" does not have any involvement with this domain name. I simply use their free email service much like yahoo or aol.

Regards,

RMF
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Now, I thought I would be the nice guy and let them buy the domain back at a reasonable price. I wasn’t going to hand it over for less than what I paid, and I want a decent price that is acceptable to me. I after all didn’t do anything wrong and the domain is valuable to my business and myself. If I had my way, I would keep the domain. But, since he was the previous owner, I thought I would be nice and offer it back for a reasonable offer since he did contact me first about purchasing it.

He then replied with this (Below). Of course, some of it is also removed with examples to keep this somewhat private.

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Mr. RMF

Thank you for your email concerning this domain name. I trust that you understand my position as President of “Bob”’s Blah Blah and Blah Blah Inc. and the responsibilities as a Director to the shareholders.

I believe that business practices are based on understanding and fairness. Having said this it is impossible for me to quantify a charge of $3000.00 for the return of this domain. The simple fact that the cost is less then $40.00 to secure a name is my bases for this decision and the fact that you noted in this email that: "Had you not been the previous owner of this domain, I wouldn't sell it."

Unfortunately your demand will not be met by my firms, however please take note, my attorneys will be in contact with you regarding a formal application to both the courts and Network Solution and "all user rights" that were in place with regards to this domain. It truly troubles me when people make an error and individuals believe that they can profit from them. I will spend the $3000. 00 to deal with this event, in a fashion that will not benefit an individual. This decision is based on a simple business principle...it is only yours because we did not renew...not because we did not own or employ the domain.

Please also note: As a courtesy to “hotmail.com” for his assisted, it is my position to allow him to have an understanding of the situation.

Please direct any future correspondence to our company attorney: Mr. “Bob”’s Attorney

Thank you for your time

Yours truly,

“Bob”
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Now, most of his email is flawed. It did cost more than $40 to acquire the domain. I’m not trying to profit from his mistakes. If I have to sell the domain, I want an acceptable price for it. It’s valuable to me because it’s a great name and I want it for my business. Also his nearly last line “it is only yours because we did not renew...not because we did not own or employ the domain” is also flawed. He didn’t renew BECAUSE he FAILED to keep his EMAIL information up-to-date. And it was incorrect for at least 2 years.

Also, a side note. I have taken screenshots of the whois database of two domains I know he owns that are very important to his business that also uses the old domain that dropped in March of 2000 as the email. This really does show that he has a history of mismanaging his domain names.

Oh, now when I check archive.org for the domain I see that “example.com” only redirected to his main domain. The domain is also not listed in search engines. So it appears it wasn’t really promoted very much. At least not online. He also said on the phone the domain was trademarked, however he did not offer any proof of this. I did a search online for any US or Canadian trademarks regarding his company and “example.com”, and found nothing except for his company name. Nothing in the trademark mentioned “example.com”.

Also, with his latest email, he has continued to involve “hotmail.com” which is not necessary. It just creates more headaches for me as “hotmail.com” is getting more worried from all of this.

It’s hard to tell, but I think this must be one of the largest posts ever made.

So, for those of you who made this far, what do you think about all this? Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

RMF