Nov 9 Is it me or are there a lot of great names dropping today

[VisualDigits]

wow, that's a great list of typos.

 

[StockDoctor]

I still think this TM Typosquatting is slimy stuff. It's a good thing when you see some of these companies get hit with court orders to pay big fines and delete the typos they use to "Steal" from the real TM holders.

In fact, even though a number of the regulars here particpate in this crap, I think there should be a seperate forum for any discussions on the crooked practice. That forum should also clearly spell out that the practice is NOT condoned by the overall membership. Otherwise, this type of (take whatever you can get away with) stuff makes us all look bad to the public. I'm not a cycbersquatter or typosquatter, but I have to fend off those kinds of labels from the public because of the blatant activities of the domainers that really do that slimeball stuff.
Doc

 

[denny007]

I still think this TM Typosquatting is slimy stuff...a number of the regulars here particpate in this crap

It is not a "number of the regulars" it is vast majority of the regulars. Including i.e. DCG and many others "high rollers". Ultsearch, which has been sold for $170M - maybe half value of this company is from typos.

Like for example realtor.com - the typos of it - is it TM or not ? Realtor is common word, but without huge popularity and marketing of the realtor.com the typos would not be that valuable.

Which domains are quickiest and easiest to sell here on DNF ? OVT typos (mostly sort of TM). So as vast majority domainers on this forum is in such domains, there should not be separate forum for them, but for the minority which has problems with it.

 

[StockDoctor]

It is not a "number of the regulars" it is vast majority of the regulars. Including i.e. DCG and many others "high rollers". Ultsearch, which has been sold for $170M - maybe half value of this company is from typos.

Like for example realtor.com - the typos of it - is it TM or not ? Realtor is common word, but without huge popularity and marketing of the realtor.com the typos would not be that valuable.

Which domains are quickiest and easiest to sell here on DNF ? OVT typos (mostly sort of TM). So as vast majority domainers on this forum is in such domains, there should not be separate forum for them, but for the minority which has problems with it.

Nothing wrong with generic typos. Trademark typos on the other hand is outright theft. Same level as those that think because a lot of Domainers put out spyware, that then it's ok. I don't agree that a vast majority of DNF members condone TM typosquatting. That's like saying a vast majority are ok with being a theif if they can make a buck off it and get away with it.

Your example "Realtor" has held up as a trademark, so the answer is YES, the typos are "squatting". Just because the term is popular or can make money doesn't give you the right to use it and steal the value of the term from the owner.

Yep, some of the easiest names to sell on the forum are TM typosquatting names and that's really a shame, cause it gives the rest of us "Honest" domainers a bad name. So many are foreigners and out of the reach of the US courts. Just like the spyware, or spammers, or the other variations of slimeballism, it's a real shame that they crap in our web.

 

[denny007]

Just FYI most of the spam comes from USA and most the worst spamers are Americans - thats about the "foreginers" notice:
http://www.spamhaus.org/rokso/index.lasso
Also the biggest typosquatters are/was Americanentities (Zuccarini, Nameking..to name a few).
As in saying "before you comment on your neighbours mess, clean your home first".

I have some nice earning typos, yet I came to the business very late - just 1 year ago. So if we are thieves, as you call us, i am asking - why those companies did not register those typos by themselves ? I.e. addias.com - they won WIPO once back in 2001, yet they did NOT renew the domain so it dropped again last year...

If I would be "honest" according your standards, I would have some crappy non-earning portfolio, as I came late to the game.

And as you write "Nothing wrong with generic typos" - how about if someone registered typo of realtor.com BEFORE they registered it as a trademark ? Should they hand it over to them otherwise they would be "thieves" according your dictionary ?

 

[StockDoctor]

As in saying "before you comment on your neighbours mess, clean your home first".

Hey I'm game, can we clean up the slimeballs operating the US spam houses too? But this was about TM typosquatters, and a lot of those slimeballs operate outside of the US.

I have some nice earning typos, yet I came to the business very late - just 1 year ago. So if we are thieves, as you call us, i am asking - why those companies did not register those typos by themselves ? I.e. addias.com - they won WIPO once back in 2001, yet they did NOT renew the domain so it dropped again last year

So you think if a company doesn't lock up all possible TM typos it's ok for someone to use them to steal traffic from the rightful owner?

If I would be "honest" according your standards, I would have some crappy non-earning portfolio, as I came late to the game.

Oh, since you were late to the game, it's ok if you do slimey stuff like typosquatting or whatever to steal. Also, in case you think you can come up with some other definition for it to suit your needs, "Honest" is "Honest" and there aren't any "standards" (or other bullchit) that allow someone to crawl under and twist the way they want so they can be a theif and still be considered "Honest".

And as you write "Nothing wrong with generic typos" - how about if someone registered typo of realtor.com BEFORE they registered it as a trademark ? Should they hand it over to them otherwise they would be "thieves" according your dictionary ?

No problem with that, and I've helped several domainers defend against domain highjacking by some crooked corporations too. Someone who registered "Realtor" or a typo "before" (many many years ago) the TM probably wouldn't have a problem. But the term "IS" a TM and if you use a typo of it now to redirect traffic for your own personal profit, you're a theif and a slimeball. Of course I'm not talking about you right? You wouldn't do something like that and think it's ok if you are outside the US courts range or can make a buck on it right?

 

[denny007]

But this was about TM typosquatters

It was you who mentioned it as an argument at first place ! Cite YOU:" So many are foreigners and out of the reach of the US courts. Just like the spyware, or spammers...". Because you wanted more arguments about those "bad foreginers". When i show you proof, that actually biggest world spammers ar Americans, you turned it into "...but this is about TM domains you #$@!...". I am sure it could be provenm that biggest cybersquatters are also Americans, yet the US population is what - like 5% of the world population ? I do not like play these nationalistic cards, but you started it, cowboy...

So you think if a company doesn't lock up all possible TM typos it's ok for someone to use them to steal traffic from the rightful owner?

First I would not call it stealing, more than like using traffic which would get wasted otherwise. And yes - because they obvoisuly does not care... My company does not have any OVT yet, but i already have typos registered, just in case, for future...

you're a theif and a slimeball

Whatever, I earn nicely, no harm done. I still prefer to be a "slimeball" and earning nice $$$ than have portfolio full of "gems" like bikeinsure.com... BTW You are calling i.e. DCG, owner of this forum, thiefe and slimeball too, because in his portfolio is a lot of nice typos as well

Of course I'm not talking about you right? You wouldn't do something like that and think it's ok if you are outside the US courts range or can make a buck on it right?

Of course I am doing that, can not imagine to earn xxx,xxx$/year on domains like bikeinsure.com...

And I would gladly go to us court, if I am sued (except I would not get visa anyway). But why actually it should be US court ? AFAIK jurisdiction is (at least according my countrys law) where you've done the "crime". But where did I do it actually ? Where I am located ? Where the registrar is located ? Where the server is located ? Where the parking server is located ? Where my bank is located, where I pick the money ? Where is jurisdiction ? Why you think it should be US !?

To educate all typo domain owners on DNF I changed my sig to get more readers to this thread. So they can learn, how good and honest you are and how dishonest slimmy thieves we are...

 

[StockDoctor]

To educate all typo domain owners on DNF I changed my sig to get more readers to this thread.

Your signature should make the distinction between typos and TM typosquatting. I'm not against the first, but the action of the second is outright theft and is slimey. To go you 1 better, I've started a new thread on the topic. Maybe bring your band over there huh?

http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?p=698509#post698509

Edited to add: About bikeinsure.com, not my best, but a top performer on a ppc basis. The thing I'm proud of though is that I created that name myself, and it works without having to steal traffic from some trademark. Honest hard work and creativity vs. traffic theft. We each go our own way I guess.

 

[denny007]

99% of typos is typos of some existing project. Even the comon words, like realtor or shoes. Without typos there would not be so many parking companies. It creates whole new industry. And no-one is loosing. If the companies would be missing traffic, they would register the typos long time before they even got some OVT. And they still can ge the domain back with WIPO. The fact, that there is so many typo TM domains parked proves, that the comapnies do not care.

Someone works hard, someone works smart. Theft is, if someone is missing something.

 

[StockDoctor]

99% of typos is typos of some existing project. Even the comon words, like realtor or shoes. Without typos there would not be so many parking companies. It creates whole new industry.

Man that's twisted. Realtor is a trademark, shoes is NOT. Get that? Wouldn't bother me a bit if there were less parking companies making money from typosquatting.

And no-one is loosing. If the companies would be missing traffic, they would register the typos long time before they even got some OVT. And they still can ge the domain back with WIPO. The fact, that there is so many typo TM domains parked proves, that the comapnies do not care.

Twisted logic again to convince yourself that it's ok to steal traffic from a trademark name. So you think that a trademark owner should have to register every possible typo or it's ok for you to use it to steal traffic? You also think if they don't lay out $1200+ for each WIPO occasion to stop you, they don't care, and they aren't losing? Sheesh!

Someone works hard, someone works smart. Theft is, if someone is missing something.

So it's ok to steal whatever you want (with your twisted logic) as long as nobody is missing it? Wow, why stop with just typosquatting? I'm sure there are some bank accounts you could get into working "smart" that wouldn't "miss something".

 

[Theo]

Doc, surely you're being sarcastic?

I'd rather have a few (few bolded) typosquatters than a "catch-all" Verisign landing page.

If we make it a crime to register typo domains, then we might as well make it a crime when someone types in the wrong domain.

 

[StockDoctor]

Doc, surely you're being sarcastic?

Not at all sarcastic. Amazes me that the crowd here is so tolerant of theft.

I'd rather have a few (few bolded) typosquatters than a "catch-all" Verisign landing page.

On Verislime, I agree and voted against them the last time they stuck in that "Sitefinder" crap. But I don't think it's one or the other when both are bad.

If we make it a crime to register typo domains, then we might as well make it a crime when someone types in the wrong domain.

Don't agree. the first is intentional theft of traffic, and the second is merely an error. Don't see the connection.

 

[Paddy]

Hey guys... do TM owners actually "own" every possible typo of their TM domain?... if not, it is not theirs to be stolen from. If so, how far do the permutations of the typo actually go, as some typos can be crazily different from the original TM domain.

If the case is that they do own "all" the typos due to the fact that the user originally intended to go to their (TM) site, and hence any typo visited meant a loss of income to the principal domain owner, then it's a different story. But it still does seem more like an implied ownership rather than an outright one. If one at all.

 

[Matrix1976]

i dont know many domainers who have never touched a tm domain or who have never used any TM'ed or Copyright material in some way...there is not many mother theresa's amongst us, including myself....its part of the business...some just push their luck more than they should and risk getting more C & D letters and/or legal problems than others...

 

[DomeBase]

It was worth a try, Doc.

 

[denny007]

1.
Stocdoctor, you still did not answer me, why you think I should be tried by US court...

2.
Shoes.com is trademark indedeed - reg.# 2606794, REGISTRANT SHOES.COM, INC. CORPORATION DELAWARE.

3.
Your arguments is always nonsense and can not be taken seriously
a.
first you blame non-American for beeign spamers, when I give you clear proof that actually Americans are biggest spamers, you back out "but we are speaking about TM domains".

You also blame non-American to beeing TM typosquatters, yet it is obvious, that still the biggest cases of typosquatters ARE Americans (while US population is less than 5% of whole worlds population)

b.
You are LYING LIKE A HELL claiming shoes.com is NOT a trade mark, GET THAT !?

c.
You arguing like people who are outside US are cowards, because they can reject to go to be tried by US court, yet do NOT explain WHY it should be US court and WHY it should be US laws which apply.

Example, maybe you will understand that (but probably you will again try some liars argument against it): If you are a Chinese and write in China somethingbad about China, you will be tried by Chinese court. If you write something like that as an Amrican in the US, no-one will tell you you are a coward, because you reject to be tried by Chinese court. Get that !?

For me LIARS LIKE YOU are 100 times worse than typosquatters !

I'm sure there are some bank accounts you could get into working "smart" that wouldn't "miss something".

If I knew about such account and could reach the money and harm nobody by it - bet your whatever I would take it !

If the case is that they do own "all" the typos due to the fact that the user originally intended to go to their (TM) site, and hence any typo visited meant a loss of income to the principal domain owner, then it's a different story. But it still does seem more like an implied ownership rather than an outright one. If one at all.

Well, there should be done some study for it. I believe, majority of the mistyped queries they realize very quickly, they are not at wished destination. But they click something if they found it interesting. And also go to the originaly intended destinaiton.

So there is NO THEFT, but rather CREATING of new traffic. I would agree we typo domaiers are "parasites", which i already claimed in some thread some time ago. But not thieves, as we do not steal, we create additional traffic, which wouild get wasted otherwise.

But this Stocdoctor's hystery forced me to create different entities of whois of my best typo domains. As I usually have several typos from one domain, so if they see "hey, he has 10 typos, lets WIPO him", while if all those 10 domains has different person in the whois, they do not want to do 10 WIPOs. Thanks Stockdoctor to let me realize, I should be more carefull, because I realized there might be more people with hysterical approach like YOU...

 

[Theo]

Sounds like "Purity of the Domain Race" by Adolph Clicker!

 

[StockDoctor]

Wow, take a chill pill dude and stick to the topic rather than personal attacks.

Stocdoctor, you still did not answer me, why you think I should be tried by US court

You need to quit with the misquotes. But to address your point to some degree, I think those that are making their living off the US market, and using TM typos to do it, should be subject to US laws and not be able to hide behind some foreign countries walls to do whatever activity they wanted with impunity.

Shoes.com is trademark indedeed - reg.# 2606794, REGISTRANT SHOES.COM, INC. CORPORATION DELAWARE.

You don't understand how TM law works, and I think a lesson here would fall on deaf ears. You just don't like me saying that typosquatters are theives, when you obviously take that as a personal attack.

first you blame non-American for beeign spamers, when I give you clear proof that actually Americans are biggest spamers, you back out "but we are speaking about TM domains".

You missed the point. US spammers can be brought to court, but some Chinese spammer can hide behind that wall over there and spam away with impunity. I agree, I think there are more US spammers than any other country, but the topic is on "typosquatting".

You also blame non-American to beeing TM typosquatters, yet it is obvious, that still the biggest cases of typosquatters ARE Americans (while US population is less than 5% of whole worlds population)

read last answer. What is your point here?

You are LYING LIKE A HELL claiming shoes.com is NOT a trade mark, GET THAT !?

Quit with the personal attacks already. It's against the forum rules for one. There is a difference if I say typosquatters are slimeballs. That is NOT a personal attack on you even if you see it that way. Further, I say again that in the case of "shoes" you do NOT have an understanding of how US TM law works.

You arguing like people who are outside US are cowards, because they can reject to go to be tried by US court, yet do NOT explain WHY it should be US court and WHY it should be US laws which apply.

Quit putting words in my mouth. Again you take my statements and attach things like "Cowards" and take personal offense. Hey buddy, if the "shoe" fits. To try to address your point "again", those typosquatters making money stealing from US businesses should NOT be able to hide behind some foreign walls to conduct their thefts.

Example, maybe you will understand that (but probably you will again try some liars argument against it): If you are a Chinese and write in China somethingbad about China, you will be tried by Chinese court. If you write something like that as an Amrican in the US, no-one will tell you you are a coward, because you reject to be tried by Chinese court. Get that !?

The language of jibberish.

For me LIARS LIKE YOU are 100 times worse than typosquatters!

There you go with the personal attacks again.

"Re:the bank account issue" If I knew about such account and could reach the money and harm nobody by it - bet your whatever I would take it !

So a direct admission that you think it's ok to steal if nobody misses the money. Sheesh!

Well, there should be done some study for it. I believe, majority of the mistyped queries they realize very quickly, they are not at wished destination. But they click something if they found it interesting. And also go to the originaly intended destinaiton. So there is NO THEFT, but rather CREATING of new traffic.

Self-serving crapola. I'm sure you can come up with better excuses than that.

I would agree we typo domaiers are "parasites", which i already claimed in some thread some time ago. But not thieves, as we do not steal, we create additional traffic, which wouild get wasted otherwise.

Yeah sure, typosquatters are a benefit to the web. Delusional thought process to justify misdirecting traffic for their own gain.

But this Stocdoctor's hystery forced me to create different entities of whois of my best typo domains. As I usually have several typos from one domain, so if they see "hey, he has 10 typos, lets WIPO him", while if all those 10 domains has different person in the whois, they do not want to do 10 WIPOs. Thanks Stockdoctor to let me realize, I should be more carefull, because I realized there might be more people with hysterical approach like YOU...

Yeah I guess if you're going to continue to be a typosquatter, you'd best run and hide your actions as best you can. Take the money and run.

 

[denny007]

Wow, take a chill pill dude and stick to the topic rather than personal attacks.

You started, now as someone has arguments against you, which youa re probably not used to it, you start the deperate "take a pill" arguments.

I say again that in the case of "shoes" you do NOT have an understanding of how US TM law works.

There is also another countries TM laws, why you again think, everything shuld follow US laws ? Ans what is the different according you: realtor.com - TM, shoes.com - not TM ?

The language of jibberish.

My english is maybe not that good, but unlike you, I can speak 6 another languages at this level too...

those typosquatters making money stealing from US businesses

First, not all typos are US related. Second - no stealing, creating MORE businesses.

So a direct admission that you think it's ok to steal if nobody misses the money.

If nobody would ever miss the money, is not theft. No harm done. SHEESH !

What scares me, there might be more $%@$#%@ like this in the states. Thank god I know most of the people on DNF are normal... I.e. I like Biggedons approach here: http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?p=699288

 

[StockDoctor]

My english is maybe not that good

Wasn't referring to your english. Think you actually do quite well in that respect. it's the logic of your argument that's twisted dude.

First, not all typos are US related. Second - no stealing, creating MORE businesses.

Yeah right.

If nobody would ever miss the money, is not theft. No harm done. SHEESH !

So again you think if the money is not missed, and you can get away with it, it's ok to steal? Remind me never to let you near my kids piggy bank.

What scares me, there might be more $%@$#%@ like this in the states. Thank god I know most of the people on DNF are normal

I never claimed to be "normal". I am a biker though, for what it's worth. :-D