Dealing with an unrealistic domain name owner

[Fatbat]

No, but if that property sits smack dab in the middle of a development project, you don't have a whole lot of rights as renter to stop the house from being sold to someone who will put the property to better use.

 

[MAllie]

Do you mean that if we might want to trademark something at some future time, we shouldn't park it with a third party? I hadn't realised.

 

[allroundguy]

Whatever, eventually ...
It is the judge who decides ...
Whether we like it or not.

TradeMark is there to protect Trade and Traders - Entreprises and Entrepreneurs.
That's the basic idea behind TM.
No Trade - No Mark ...
That has nothing to do with domains.
If there is no activity under a name by somebody else, it can be registered as a domain.
In theory, if a company stops all activities and surrenders all assets and registrations as required for it's business, then the outcome of a TM dispute is not very predictable.
A court could order that the trademark is void because there is no activity with it, and any domain with the TM in it would probable have to be transfered to the new TM holder if there is one.

Quoting USPTO Faq.:
What is a trademark or service mark?

* A trademark is a word, phrase, symbol or design, or a combination of words, phrases, symbols or designs, that identifies and distinguishes the source of the goods of one party from those of others.
* A service mark is the same as a trademark, except that it identifies and distinguishes the source of a service rather than a product. Throughout this booklet, the terms "trademark" and "mark" refer to both trademarks and service marks.

IMHO it is clear that there can be only a TM for a good, an activity.

 

[MAllie]

I find this all a bit confusing allroundguy. I understand about not taking names that might infringe already present trademarks. But if I think up a good name for a web business I want to run and park it while I'm preparing to develop, how can someone else come along and set up a business with that name and then demand my name? I had it first. I mean, I'm sure they can register a company with that name, but they won't have the right to demand the name I've registered if I registered it before they set up their business. Surely any competent entrepreneur would first check that the domain name is free for a company he want to register, or would try to buy it from me?

 

[allroundguy]

I find this all a bit confusing allroundguy. I understand about not taking names that might infringe already present trademarks. But if I think up a good name for a web business I want to run and park it while I'm preparing to develop, how can someone else come along and set up a business with that name and then demand my name? I had it first. I mean, I'm sure they can register a company with that name, but they won't have the right to demand the name I've registered if I registered it before they set up their business. Surely any competent entrepreneur would first check that the domain name is free for a company he want to register, or would try to buy it from me?

It may be not easy to understand, but a TM do can be disputed for certain reasons.
Some things are explained quite well here:
http://www.dnforum.com/f26/parked-p...use-under-us-trademark-law-thread-318948.html
Also, it should be looked up what was there first (chicken or egg ...) the domain (SLD) or the TM.

Anyway, we see that TM (Law) has priority over Intellectual Property as set forth by WIPO (Convention, Treaty).

Example:
In the eBay vs. PerfumeBay case WIPO said Perfumebay.com did not infringe eBay's rights, then a Court decided otherwise ...

 

[Domainator]

The more interest you show in the domain, the more your telling the owner you really want it... I would tell him that you can only afford to pay $400, make up a hardship story, If he responds back and says no, Reply back and say if you change your mind, please let me know... Keep that window open, and be nice and polite. Then sit back and wait, It takes time for some sellers to come down to reality.

So Raider, your the one that gives me all the hardship stories....:lol::lol:

 

[allroundguy]

I play the waiting game too Acro, I quote the price once and it's the last time I contact them until they contact me... But their are domainers more motivated than we are, many are deperate for cash and will take what they can get.

I remember offering a domainer $300 a dot org, It was a catchy domain and very brandable, He was asking $2500 which was outrageous, I chose to forget about it and deleted his email, then he wrote me back saying he's open to offers, I told him $300 is all I'm willing to do.. This went on for 2 weeks until he dropped it to $500.. I refused again and told him $300 is all I'm willing to pay... Never heard from him again.

Let's face it:
People just don't like to pay!
I too, don't like to pay.
But I will pay what I can if I really want something.

Outrageous? For some people, yes.
Meet the risk of negotiating endlessly: Somebody can get fed up and drop the whole thing.
We all know that we can remain stuck with high- priced domains.
But it is oh so nice to sell one for over $10,000.00 every now and then instead of begging to get $5,00 for it fast.
Of course, everybody conducts business by his/her own systems.

 

[built4impact]

But that sounds absolutely horrible! You can't get someone to sell you the domain you want, so you are going to get it by any means you can? Bad enough that there are folks prepared to scam to get domains, but now there is some pseudo-legal route? I think that's appalling and I wouldn't have any business dealings with someone like you. How could I ever trust you if you are prepared to use methods like these? For me this is the dark face of domaining, no matter how clever you make it sound. As someone whose parents once lost their home through this kind of action, your words pierce my soul.

Well, I'm going to thank you all (especially MAllie, Acro, and others that got my little gears turning). You were all absolutely right in your responses. The scenario was that the company I worked for built a datacenter and used a domain they didn't own as the root. The price for the domain was $25k+, so they decided to trademark their datacenter architecture and claim the name as if they had rights to it.

Yes, you read correct, I no longer work for that company. Between the comments I received and my own domainer morals, I went against The Man. Not long after, I was informed that my position was being eliminated due to "cutbacks", and my services were no longer needed. Ironically enough, I was the only "cutback" at the corporate office.

I know I did the right thing, but getting a small business off the ground in our current ecconomic climate won't be easy. I'll be selling many of my domains to put money into it, and I'll be sure and list them all here first.

Thanks again, and if anyone needs some quality design or marketing work done, don't be shy. I'll be ditching the Flash for SEO reasons and updating my website soon. I'll also be expanding my service offerings as well. Take a look if you want - www.built4impact.com

Cheers!

 

[MAllie]

built4impact, I'm glad you've been able to settle things with yourself. It may be hard going setting up on your own, but at least you'll be able to sleep at night. If I'm ever in a position to hire a good developer, I'll certainly keep you in mind.