Sedo please read

iBizStart · Apr 5, 2005

Not a scam.

I'm just playing with such suckers like AllForDomains.com and Sedo.com. WHY?

In my opinion appraisal service on domain names is a scam. Appraisers like AllForDomains.com, Sedo.com and Aftrenic.com are showing bogus figures and charge money for nothing. This is a big trap for all the domainers.

How can we stop them? There is only one way! When you order a service and then make charge back the company will have to pay the charge back fee. If they get too many charge backs they will have to close the business.

I've decided to stop teh domain appraisal scam this way.

It works very simple. Earlier I made several charge backs but it was not enough to stop them. Now I've contacted several domain sellers and asked them to order appraisals at Sedo.com and AllForDomains.com. Then I asked domain sellers to cancel these orders because it was a joke.

As a result AllForDomains.com and Sedo.com will lose big money on charge backs. My goal is to destroy AllForDomains and Sedo.

Thank you for helping me to crash these appraisers.

Now my traget is Afternic.com. I will ask people to order appraisals at Aftrenic.com and then I will tell them about my jokes.

Aftrenic.com (like AllForDomains.com) will have to stop their appraisal business due to high amount of charge backs and charge back fees.

Yahooo!! We'll destroy them!!!
----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 11:41 PM
Subject: Re: Bid on goldencrown.com

Nice scam. You almost seemed like a legitimate buyer. Thanks anyways and good luck ripping someone else off.

In a message dated 4/5/2005 3:37:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:

Do you sell a developed site or just domain name? If you don't have a site it's not a problem. I'm mostly interested in domain names without content.

Do you have an appraisal of your domain? I need an appraisal certificate before making an offer. Domain name is an investment for me. I'm going to sell your name later and make a profit. If I overpay I won't be able to make a profit in the future. So I need to know the current market value of your name. I guess your are also interested in getting this figure.

Please note that I don't trust free or cheap appraisals. So we cannot accept appraisal from each and every site.

Earlier I had a bad experience with Afternic.com. I also found the following information about them.
http://forum.icann.org/nsi2001/3AC75D7900000305.html

To avoid mistakes I asked domain experts about reputable appraisal companies in a forum.
http://domaintalk.ourplace.com/Archive/11076.htm
Juck check this posting.

After I verify an appraisal from you we'll continue our negotiations.

How do you prefer to get paid: www.PayPal.com, www.escrow.com, check or wire?

Looking forward to your reply.

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 9:19 PM
Subject: Re: Bid on goldencrown.com

I have previously tried selling my name but I am not getting the response I want. It is a very brandable casino domain name and so I guess the people that would be interested are the ones that are going to be building a casino site. Most "domainers" are looking for linkpop or traffic, not anything brandable. I have actually taken the name off sale because I did not get any offers and I am currently developing it into a casino review site. You are more then welcome to submit an offer but I do not have a price in mind that I am willing to accept right now.

I hope that helps
Thank You

P.S. Everything can stay confidential as you wish.

In a message dated 4/5/2005 5:59:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:

Hi,

I'm writing regarding your domain for sale I saw about two weeks ago. Unfortunately, I was busy and could not contact you at that time.

Is it still available for sale? Have you received any bids from other buyers?

Please email me your asking price.

If I can afford your domain I will contact you. Please keep my email address and our correspondence confidential.

I run a software development company. Selling & buying names is not my main business. Just another way to invest free money and make some income.

Kindest regards,

Trevor Berger

CEO

Chams Consulting

Cost Analysis & Revenue Assurance Software.

04/05/05.

diverge · Apr 5, 2005

byalik -- who are you in the email conversation above?

iBizStart · Apr 5, 2005

I am [email protected]. That person contacted me pretending to be interested in my domain, goldencrown.com.

gshafir · Apr 5, 2005

I have that e-mail you received requesting you to pay for an appraisal in my inbox verbatim. I figured it was a scam by an appraisal service to drum up business.

I do agree appraisal services are absolute nonsense.

iBizStart · Apr 5, 2005

I agree as well but telling people to give them chargebacks so they lose money is a different issue.

csitenet · Apr 5, 2005

lol, sedo / afternic appraise domains to the BEST end user value possible though unrelistic unless you own blog.com or download.com etc. You are unlikely to ever sell at a price they appraise... No wonder they get chargebacks. I also think personally sedo charges VERY high rates for their showcase! i actually kept track of domains selling in the showcase in the front page! its less than 5-10% chance of sell!

+ thats not all, i have seen many submit offers to their own domains to pull it up in sedo! they must really stop these. I think their biggest problem is domain parking. The high fraud click rate is AMAZING, i am sure almost 80% of domain parkers have clicked on their link at least 1-2 x without any intrest to earn money!

gshafir · Apr 5, 2005

I'm confused, he sent you an e-mail requesting an appraisal then told you to request a chargeback... or is that a third party?

iBizStart · Apr 5, 2005

He wanted me to get an appraisal. Then he was going to tell me he is no longer interested in my domain and I should do a chargeback against sedo/afternic or whatever other company that offers appraisals.

SedoCoUk · Apr 6, 2005

Thanks for the heads up guys. Not a particularly original idea, though. It even has a legal name: Chargeback Fraud. You can be prosecuted for it, lose your credit card and be blacklisted with credit institutions. The growing number and influence of online companies, such as Ebay, are moving credit card companies to react ever more harshly against this practice which is, basically, the same as saying 'Go to your local supermarket and steal lots of stuff. It's great, you can drive them out of business.'

I'm sorry if some of you are not happy with the appraisal service we offer. Appraising a domain is not an easy job, but our expert appraisal team are among the best in the business. Each appraisal is fully carried out by one of our team and not by a machine like many other appraisals out there. We are the world's leading domain trading platform and use our expertise and experience in the domain sales business to set our appraisal values at a price which we believe to be the real, fair market value. This unparalleled experience means that we can generally provide a very accurate appraisal value. We do tend to err on the side of caution as we would prefer our customers' domains to be appraised at $ 6,000 and sell at $ 9,000 than for us to appraise it at $ 12,000 and see it sell for $ 9,000. There are enough appraisal services out there who will tell you how fantastic your name is. We leave ego-stroking to them.
It is unfortunate if our appraisal value does not match the high expectations you have for the name. It is in no way in our interest to undervalue your domain name. We simply value it at what we believe is the true market value. We do make mistakes in this matter, obviously. Appraising a domain is extremely tricky. Who would have thought that spearfishing.com would have been worth $ 18,500. However, we do believe we are among the best-qualified people in the industry to carry out realistic appraisals.
As a sign of how accurate our appraisals are: our domain acquisition service has a 70+% success rate when the buyer makes an offer at the amount our appraisal team appraises the domain at.

Again, I would urge you not to take part in chargeback fraud as it doesn't help anybody. I apologise if you feel that our appraisal service has not satisfied your wishes, but I'm sure the majority of satisfied customers we have would support me in saying that trying to bring the industry to its knees because of it by partaking in fraudulent activity isn't exactly the greatest way to voice your disapproval.

Feel free to email me at [email protected] if you have any further questions.

Ed

fatter · Apr 7, 2005

just a comment on appraissals, while I feel that services that trick you into getting an appraissal like the one who says they are an interested buyer, (are scams)there is a definate need for legit apprassal services for business purposes, wether to establish equity for loans, or perhaps donating a domain,tax purposes to show a loss, maybe bought a domain for 50k and now appraissal says its worth 1k, or a slew of ther legit reasons.appraissing is tough on many names that a clear income strategy hasnt been developed yet but I think to say domain appraissals are scams is a little to harsh. Most domain forums are looked at through a resellers eyes and might not be best form for appraissals. an independent body that can look more through an endusers eyes(like sedo) might be more appropiate.
Just an example is how many appraise a p parked domain at ones years income. why would i sell a domain earning 500 dollars a yr for less than 500 dollars. thats 500 dollars a year for life only expense is 8 dollar reg fee,not to mention and enduser who might stumble on it and pay 10 to 20 times that amount

datawan · Apr 7, 2005

I think the only way to get domain appraissals to where they need to be is we need a big gun or someone who is respected to start doing them. A standardized appraisal format or company to handle the overlooking and analysis of domains names.

If every tom,dick and harry could appraise art and antiques and sell it at sotherbys then the whole market would collapse. Thats why you have certified and trained individuals who can appraise an item and it be held up in the market.

Just my thoughts...

namestrands · Apr 9, 2005

This is not a SEDO scam... I get several emails from this company about them wanting to buy my domains.

Basically once you reply, they say that they are interested in your domain, but they cant part with cash without an appraisal.. they then supply you with 3 companies that do appraisals..

You will find that the guy wanting the domain is in fact the owner of the appraisal company that offers the cheapest appraisals. That is the Scam. Sedo and others are not the scammers.

You charging back your Credit card is illegal, it wont be SEDO that loses it will be you.

domain newbie · Apr 13, 2005

to :byalik and co
i had a exactly same emails from that [email protected] !

almost got happy, when his offer to pay 500 paunds for my britishcock.com (which i listed on ebay earlyer)

and when i got the same email to my other email adress, about the other domain , i tould him 2 p..s off!

before that his last email was:

500. Ok.

Do you sell a developed site or just domain name? If you don't have a site it's not a problem. I'm mostly interested in domain names without content.

Do you have an appraisal of your domain? I need an appraisal certificate for domain priced in your range. Domain name is an investment for me. I'm going to sell your name later and make a profit. If I overpay I won't be able to make a profit in the future. So I need to know the current market value of your name. I guess your are also interested in getting this figure.

Please note that I don't trust free or cheap appraisals. So we cannot accept appraisal from each and every site.

To avoid mistakes I asked domain experts about reputable appraisal companies in a forum.
http://domaintalk.ourplace.com/Archive/11076.htm
Juck check this posting.

After I verify an appraisal from you we'll continue our negotiations.

How do you prefer to get paid: www.PayPal.com, www.escrow.com, check or wire?

Looking forward to your reply.

:-D

ohhh, sorry wasnt really reading much before posting that...

donyll · Jun 27, 2005

Hi Guys,

I fell for the scam by:
Peter Weldon <[email protected]>

I'm new to the game and got excited about the prospect of a sale.

DavidAusman · Jun 27, 2005

byalik said:
----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 11:41 PM
Subject: Re: Bid on goldencrown.com

Nice scam. You almost seemed like a legitimate buyer. Thanks anyways and good luck ripping someone else off.

In a message dated 4/5/2005 3:37:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:

Do you sell a developed site or just domain name? If you don't have a site it's not a problem. I'm mostly interested in domain names without content.

Do you have an appraisal of your domain? I need an appraisal certificate before making an offer. Domain name is an investment for me. I'm going to sell your name later and make a profit. If I overpay I won't be able to make a profit in the future. So I need to know the current market value of your name. I guess your are also interested in getting this figure.

Please note that I don't trust free or cheap appraisals. So we cannot accept appraisal from each and every site.

Earlier I had a bad experience with Afternic.com. I also found the following information about them.
http://forum.icann.org/nsi2001/3AC75D7900000305.html

To avoid mistakes I asked domain experts about reputable appraisal companies in a forum.
http://domaintalk.ourplace.com/Archive/11076.htm
Juck check this posting.

After I verify an appraisal from you we'll continue our negotiations.

How do you prefer to get paid: www.PayPal.com, www.escrow.com, check or wire?

Looking forward to your reply.

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 9:19 PM
Subject: Re: Bid on goldencrown.com

I have previously tried selling my name but I am not getting the response I want. It is a very brandable casino domain name and so I guess the people that would be interested are the ones that are going to be building a casino site. Most "domainers" are looking for linkpop or traffic, not anything brandable. I have actually taken the name off sale because I did not get any offers and I am currently developing it into a casino review site. You are more then welcome to submit an offer but I do not have a price in mind that I am willing to accept right now.

I hope that helps
Thank You

P.S. Everything can stay confidential as you wish.

In a message dated 4/5/2005 5:59:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:

Hi,

I'm writing regarding your domain for sale I saw about two weeks ago. Unfortunately, I was busy and could not contact you at that time.

Is it still available for sale? Have you received any bids from other buyers?

Please email me your asking price.

If I can afford your domain I will contact you. Please keep my email address and our correspondence confidential.

I run a software development company. Selling & buying names is not my main business. Just another way to invest free money and make some income.

Kindest regards,

Trevor Berger

CEO

Chams Consulting

Cost Analysis & Revenue Assurance Software.

04/05/05.

This email looks exactly like what i used to receive for webmasterwatch.net where i fall into his stupid trap. I did order an apprisal from afternic.com and it seems useless.

This guy has tons of email account i guess.
What is he up to? trying to bring down companies?

fatter · Jun 27, 2005

as long as there is profit to be made these guys will do well, not much different then praying on mothers who think there child is a beauty only pay the 100 dollar reg fee to get listed in their directory, cons are good at finding weakness in human nature,
when you you get to be my age when someone asks for money a big flag goes up.

i am not talking about sedo here they are a legit company that doesnt trick people into getting an apprassal

Premium Domains · Jun 28, 2005

I would like to put in a word for Sedo here. I have used Sedo since the sedo.us days (they did not own sedo.com yet) and have been in the domain business for over 8 years. I have ordered appraisals, parked domains, sold and traded domains at almost all the services out there. I was an Afternic member before it was sold out (and was much better before) and a Greatdomains member (I dont know how many of you guys remember them).

And what I gotta say is this...... Sedo is the most upright, honest and PROFITABLE domain broker I have used.

Let me tell you about a true story that happened with me. One of my domains was receiving unnatural traffic and Sedo took it off the top 20 list because they thought that the traffic was being manipulated. I have never done stupid things like fraud clicks and I wrote to Sedo's owner Tim Schumacher that I did not expect such treatment being an honest customer (and also one of the earliest). And guess what? Tim replied to my mail immediately and the problem was sorted out. Do you think a CEO of ANY of the big domain related companies would actually take time out to reply to individual complaints? So that reinforced my belief in Sedo.

Another point. I make almost 2000 Euros/month on Sedoparking. Never made that kind of money with any other parking service. I sell domains worth 10,000 Euros (minimum) per year at Sedo. They have always paid in time and never defaulted. I buy a lot of domains on Sedo without problems. I have ordered their domain appraisals 4 to 5 times and I found then to be alrite.

The scam you are talking about has been created by these fly-by-night companies who want to scam you, take your money, and find another sucker. THEY should be paying for their crimes. So I suggest you file a criminal complaint with the legal authorities about them, instead of doing something stupid which could land you into jail. 'Dont let your anger blind your eyes to the truth'.

Let me also say here that I have no vested interest in either Sedo or anyone else in here. I just want everybody to know the truth.

Thanks,