Why fraudsters will never win

[David G]

I applaud Don Simon and his work and also his honesty and openess in discussing this, something other ppc firms do not talk about much for some odd reason. Traffic fraud needs to be stopped since it hurts us all and makes honest domainers have lower ppc clicks than they would get if no fraud.

Don needs to be very cautious even when dealing with the accounts of some who I strongly suspect are involved in very complex and amazingly tricky traffic schemes. One person in particular (who I will not name) is an expert at traffic and almost certainly is doing that and even the very sharp Don Simon (or his provider) would not realize how the the traffic was arriving as it looks totally legit (and in fact it is genuine in an odd kind of way) but I am probably the only one who knows about the elaborate scheme (but complete evidence is lacking).

 

[namestrands]

I applaud Don Simon and his work and also his honesty and openess in discussing this, something other ppc firms do not talk about much for some odd reason. Traffic fraud needs to be stopped since it hurts us all and makes honest domainers have lower ppc clicks than they would get if no fraud.

Don needs to be very cautious even when dealing with the accounts of some domain forum members who I strongly suspect are involved in very complex and amazingly tricky traffic schemes. One person in particular (who I will not name) is an expert at traffic and almost certainly is doing that and even the very sharp Don Simon (or his provider) would not realize how the the traffic was arriving as it looks totally legit (and in fact it is genuine in an odd kind of way).

but I am probably the only one who knows about the elaborate scheme (but complete evidence is lacking).

As phineasphog said; everyone has to tackle this problem, perhaps you should let the parking programs know about this "possible kind of genuine fraud" that you are eluding to and the parking programs are ignorant too.

If they are not already aware of this, then you would be doing them a favour by letting them know, which would allow them to take action.

 

[David G]

A problem in reporting it is its all circumstantial evidence.

 

[jimbaggs]

One person in particular (who I will not name) is an expert at traffic and almost certainly is doing that and even the very sharp Don Simon (or his provider) would not realize how the the traffic was arriving as it looks totally legit (and in fact it is genuine in an odd kind of way) but I am probably the only one who knows about the elaborate scheme (but complete evidence is lacking).

I'd like to know more about this "genuine fraud".

 

[namestrands]

A problem in reporting it is its all circumstantial evidence.

Well inform the programs and let them decide, I am quite confident that all the programs have people who are smart enough to figure out if your "Fake Genuine Traffic" is a potential threat or Pie in the Sky

 

[bosworth]

sick pepl doing sick thing!
all sick!!

 

[LucidPhoenix]

A problem in reporting it is its all circumstantial evidence.

Thank goodness this is a civil issue rather then a criminal one.

:car:

 

[jimbaggs]

Thank goodness this is a civil issue rather then a criminal one.

:car:

Since when?

 

[David G]

Thank goodness this is a civil issue rather then a criminal one. :car:

For it to be investigated by someone else I would need to reveal the name of the suspect and will not do that and possibly cause negativity without more substantial evidence. Still working on the case which is extremely complex (especially for a non-geek and issue may never be fully verified). Now regret mentioning it here.

 

[Duckinla]

FYI, was reading in USA today that online advertising revenue is up some ridiculous amount like 25% this year over last. On the surface that sounds great, but being an insider my initial thoughts were less than optimistic. I started wondering if anyone will come to the conclusion that the 25% increase is just a result of low-quality clicks from the explosion in Fraud, parked domains, template domains, underdeveloped domains, etc. Other than the fraud part, I don't exclude myself from that crowd. As domainers we absolutely have to do whatever we can to make sure the advertisers get value for their money. Otherwise, the gig is up.

 

[Ian]

Other than the fraud part, I don't exclude myself from that crowd. As domainers we absolutely have to do whatever we can to make sure the advertisers get value for their money.

I agree with you Duckinla. we as domainers have a big part to play to provide advertisers genuine quality traffic for their their money.

 

[jimbaggs]

I have to say this again because it bears repeating. A dollar stolen by a CFr isn't really one taken from the Advertising Community. They will even out the score by adjusting the prices paid as the conversion results become apparent. Instead the dollar stolen in the end comes out of the aggregated pocket of the Domain Owners as a whole. We're the ones who suffer the heat loss.

14% fraud = 14% lower RPCs.

The question is: What can we and will we do about it?

 

[namestrands]

we start to name and shame.

 

[Preoccupy]

I think fraudsters don't have not enough experience in ppc business.

Fraudsters think ppc company will never know about the cheat, but ppc company finally will find all fraud just take time to search them.

fraudsters have to relize they will caught someday......

 

[Duckinla]

I think the parking companies must step up vigilance on the issue, Particularly when a new customer shows up from out of nowhere with lots of traffic and clicks.
Rather than just be happy about the business, you have to wonder where it's coming from, what were the domains doing before? Depending on your pay schedule, a parking company has from 15 days to 75 days to scrutinize new traffic before a fraudster gets paid.

It's not enough to catch them "eventually" in my opinion. Since there are no real legal ramifications, I think fraudsters are more than happy to get paid 2 or 3 times before they get shut down. It's a game they can run over and over again unless they start getting caught before the first payout.

 

[Preoccupy]

I totally agree with you!!! In order for PPC companies to catch these fraudsters before their first pay, they will need to update their software program and have good technicians/analysts who can search where the clicks are coming from and the background, and etc...

opcorn: :couch2:
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I think the parking companies must step up vigilance on the issue, Particularly when a new customer shows up from out of nowhere with lots of traffic and clicks.
Rather than just be happy about the business, you have to wonder where it's coming from, what were the domains doing before? Depending on your pay schedule, a parking company has from 15 days to 75 days to scrutinize new traffic before a fraudster gets paid.

It's not enough to catch them "eventually" in my opinion. Since there are no real legal ramifications, I think fraudsters are more than happy to get paid 2 or 3 times before they get shut down. It's a game they can run over and over again unless they start getting caught before the first payout.

 

[Donny Simonton]

There are two things that need to happen to stop somebody who is coming in the door with a lot of traffic.

1. Beep, Beep Beep Beep Beep.
2. Bla Bla, Bla Bla bla and Bla.

Once you can figure that out the rest is simple.

Donny

 

[Preoccupy]

ha, ha, ha, It is so funny....you'r right. :angel_smile:

There are two things that need to happen to stop somebody who is coming in the door with a lot of traffic.

1. Beep, Beep Beep Beep Beep.
2. Bla Bla, Bla Bla bla and Bla.

Once you can figure that out the rest is simple.

Donny

 

[Dr Nump]

I am sorry Donny , but I have to agree with namestrands . You guy dont have the right to share your customers's infos to any others providers or any orgs , protect privacy is the 1st rules on internet .

 

[GT Web]

I am sorry Donny , but I have to agree with namestrands . You guy dont have the right to share your customers's infos to any others providers or any orgs , protect privacy is the 1st rules on internet .

Bullcrap, if someone is cheating the system, let all the other parking companies know. I don't want potential earnings taken by a bunch of Chinese traffic fakers.