For Sale Pool must be bidding in its own auctions and running up prices

[clemzonguy]

OK I give up, who is BFD?

BFD = term coined on this forum to refer to Buydomains (BD) except insertion of an explitive in the middle. You do the math lol. Seems to have caught on like wildfire.

 

[RMF]

Why don't some of you do some pool investigation?. Put a couple crappy domains that NOBODY would want, put a high proxy on one account, and a low proxy on the other. See if the high proxy gets taken out. If you got some obvious proof of false bidding by pool, then you could file a lawsuit against them.

RMF

 

[Digital Address]

Why don't some of you do some pool investigation?. Put a couple crappy domains that NOBODY would want, put a high proxy on one account, and a low proxy on the other. See if the high proxy gets taken out. If you got some obvious proof of false bidding by pool, then you could file a lawsuit against them.

RMF

Now that's using your head! Could be done as a team effort using PMs or emails to avoid being detected.

 

[adoptabledomains]

The reason is simple: Pool beats any other public domain grabbing system hands down. NW won't catch a name that has a Pool backorder, EVER.

Not true! Yes, Pool probably grabs a name 3 to 1 head to head against NW, but win does win sometimes. I just picked up a name a few days ago I had at both that NW got over pool. When I have a name that I think is worth $60 or more or that bids above that at NW, I'll place it on both NW and pool. Therefore I do see head to head how they do.

I actually think NW has a better record at catching .info's than pool, but less at .com

 

[adoptabledomains]

So, there is always someone who likes a domain badly and willing to place a higher bid.
I can't think of any reason why edeals.com closes at several thousand bucks at NameWinner and at $60k at pool.com rather than pool is bidding agaist the higher proxy bid.

I think the reason Pool generally get's higher bids is the model they use. NW is kind of dissapointing knowing you may bid up to some high level and still not get the name. Then the final bidding is in the last 10 minutes meaning some people are not available in that 10 minute period. I know I may have won more names there if I could have been available from 10am to 10:10 PST.

However, at pool, you know that if you keep bidding you WILL get the name because bids don't really start until they have the domain, and can last a full 3 days instead of 10 minutes. With 3 days and the guarantee you have the name if you're high bidder, you have 3 days to find a retail buyer. I've thought of using my bidding position there to presell the domain or take an option on it when it's above what I'd pay wholesale. (example: anyone interested in cigarettesales.com? I'm outbid at $80 now with 1-1/2 days to go, but will go higher if someone wants to buy from me).

Also, NW limits the max mid of newer bidders. when I signed up I had a $100 bid limit. It's now $1000, but I'm sure some people just don't go to the trouble to get that raised in the last minutes of the bid when they decide they really want it and other bidders are proving it has value. NW is cutting it's own throat by this policy.

I also think Pool has better search tools and probably more customers than NW, therefore more competition in auctions. I get presest keyword lists emailed to me daily from pool, but have to search NW on their site.

Incidentally, today I got the name SaltwaterAquarium.net for $60 with no competetive bidders at pool, but NW had competetive bidders and was bid to near $100 I think (I wish history stayed there). You never can predict.

I hope pool is not cheating, and personally have no indication that they are. In auction history I can see lots of names with proxies much higher than the winning price. (Examples from my auction loss history: salespeople.com sold for $5850, proxy was $8300; BusinessPlan.info sold for $250, but had a proxy of $1500; theme.info sold for $90 , proxy of $660)

 

[Steen]

about bfd-

I dont see the sense in it.

Just call em BuyDomains/BD (imo).

 

[seeker]

NW just got me a domain that had a pool backorder on it!

Of course, the price was at lower mid $XXX

First time NW outperforms pool for me other than for a .info

 

[sitehq]

what i suggest is if more than one dnforum member is going for a name, lets start an after-pool auction, that way the lowest real bidder can get it from pool, then make the difference that would have gone to pool from another dnforum members..

its auction rigging on the buyer side...its been done on the ebay system for years.

what i have been doing is instead of running up a name on pool, i let someone win and then offer them 300 more the next day, at least that way they get the money, not pool.

page howe

so pm me if your going for a $500 to $4k name on pool and i'll tell you what i'll go.

or .....maybe real bidders are buying the names.

 

[adoptabledomains]

what i have been doing is instead of running up a name on pool, i let someone win and then offer them 300 more the next day, at least that way they get the money, not pool.

That's what I forsee happening with the WLS. One person will get it and it will be on the auctions pretty quickly. For that matter since it's pretty much guaranteed upon pending delete status, it could be pre-auctioned even before title is held.

 

[sitehq]

or lets all meet in chat and really conspire ... real time

 

[options]

- catch domains that are available for registration that you didn't order and charge you $60 for that.

Their e-mail notification does it in a misleading way.
If they have some names matching your keywords, you get the message including: "Some of the new domains that became available today" field with the linked name.

If you click on the name, the name is automatically added to your backorder list even if you are not (automaticaly) logged-in.

Indeed there are small letters above the field in the cleverly designed e-mail saying: "Ready to backorder? Click on a domain in the chart below and it will be added to your list of backordered domains."

For sure, I don't think it is a respectable business practice.

 

[options]

It seems that many people here overlooked the real reason for complains.
It is not about losing the bid form higher bidder, but GETTING a name for max or near maximum price.

 

[bocajohnh]

...complains. It is not about losing the bid form higher bidder, but GETTING a name for max or near maximum price.

Bingo. That's one reason I stay out of pool.com auctions. If I overpay and some time in the future find out that pool.com was the other bidder and this was all a sham... Well, let's just not put it in writing...

If I want a name, and use pool.com and they get it for just me, fine. If they get me a name and it goes into auction, whether there is a real other bidder or not, I walk. Sorry, fishy smell == fishy.

 

[Theo]

NW just got me a domain that had a pool backorder on it!

Of course, the price was at lower mid $XXX

First time NW outperforms pool for me other than for a .info

Proves my point: if you want a name bad enough, no alternative to using Pool.

 

[nitronet]

It seems that many people here overlooked the real reason for complains.
It is not about losing the bid form higher bidder, but GETTING a name for max or near maximum price.

Getting the name at maximum price because I was bidding against another "human" that also wanted the name is one story. Bidding against the "house or a Pool.com bot" that is running the auctions up is another.

The fact is nobody will probably ever know the truth, but I have enough doubt that I refuse to give Pool another dime of my money.

 

[Nameable]

I was all ready to defend pool (free market, caveat emptor, blah blah), but I just got a confirmation email with 3 catches, two of which I did NOT and would never have ordered.

It would seem something is afoot.

 

[puravida]

Nobody other than Pool knows what our top bids are and they are the only ones with anything to gain and nothing to lose by bidding the auctions up.

First off, for the most part (99%); I do agree.

However, you would be surprised what a good analysis can teach you in a bid war. I monitor every major player, track and chart their bid history, and compare their bid strategy. I watch the WHOIS and compare bid history, amounts, etc to build a developed overview of how they think.

...And, you had better believe that Ultsearch and BFD do exactly the same thing! For instance, according to my strategy; I was recently in a bid war with Ultsearch. I won the name, but they bid up to exactly $10 less than what they "thought" my max bid was. Their assumption was based on my previous max bid and they assumed that I simply added $200 to my bid. So, they bid $190 more. It's pretty crappy that they do that, but I have to admit --when I am 99% confident that I am bidding against BFD or Ultsearch, you better believe I spike that damn price as high as possible too!! :bandit:

It's risky, so kids don't try this at home. But, I remember one that I spiked over $30K that one of them got... they almost let me have it ::
It probably would've closed for around $20K otherwise. This in and of itself is a bid strategy designed to drain the wallet and make the next bid war tilt in your favor. However, in my experience; their wallets are just too deep for them to give a sh*t.

my 2cents.

 

[puravida]

Don't forget their wonderful hot "blackmail" list. "You don't have to bid with us, but if you don't come in early enough, we may just publicize the name you want with the rest of our customers...

Pool is starting to look more and more like a Verisign company to me.

Both companies feel that instead of catering to the needs and wants of your customers; it's less expensive and easier to simply force a monopoly on the users and make them come to you.

NetSol sucked and then Verisign bought them... Customers were leaving in droves before and even faster afterwards. So, in response to losing millions of customers (domains), they decide to shoot for WLS and effectively force the customers back --after they've spit on them.

So, whose worse? Big bully Pool? or Big bully Verisign? Only time will tell, but I bet we won't be happy either way.

-Wesley

 

[puravida]

I think the reason Pool generally get's higher bids is the model they use. NW is kind of dissapointing knowing you may bid up to some high level and still not get the name. Then the final bidding is in the last 10 minutes meaning some people are not available in that 10 minute period. I know I may have won more names there if I could have been available from 10am to 10:10 PST.

This is right-on.

The NW model only worked back when they had no competition. I used them successfully many times (over 3 years ago), and I didn't mind bidding on domains that I might not get --because I did get several.

However... now their system is worthless. When you don't grab more than 1 in 20; what is my incentive to 100% waste my time bidding for a 5% chance of getting the name?? I only use NW for names that are in my top 5% want list --otherwise, they're useless.

I would bet that Pool has at least 10:1 or 20:1 customers over NW.

-Wesley

 

[bidawinner]

All this discussion is fine but will never really stop the scams ..

This is a pretty good starting point though If you want to see people sweat http://www.fbi.gov/hq.htm

all it takes is a handful of you making the same complaint of conspiracy and fraud and they'll come a knocking on you knnow who's door.

Whats interesting is some people will think thats too drastic..

It's amazing how many peope can get screwed and they go back for seconds and 3rds .