Roundtable or T.R.A.F.F.I.C. (or neither)?

[GeorgeK]

Rick likes to pretend that he invented the domain conference concept, and that anyone else is an "imitator", and owes him something. His conference was not the first (nor will it be the last).

On Archive.org, one can see that there was a conference in NYC in 2002:

http://web.archive.org/web/20021017070615/http://domainnameconference.com/index.html

Howard Neu even spoke at that conference. So, it's clear the concept is not novel, and Jay owes Rick NOTHING.

Why doesn't Rick explain his *3* UDRP losses? Yet, on www.domaindevelopers.com, he says "0" losses.

http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?t=92097&highlight=voyuer.com

Or why he continues to tell people that he sold Men.com for $1.3 million, whereas we know it included dirtyjokes.com?

http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?t=91330&page=1&pp=15
Because its my domain I bought from Rick (WebFather) when I bought Men.com (post #10).

Keep living in a fantasyworld, where you think others owe YOU an explanation. You need to do some explaining, or continue to see your credibility fall to new lows. That's why I was banned from your board, as you would rather live in that fantasy world -- too bad 1/2 your board who still talks to me disagrees.

I'd like to add this post was in direct response to the incredible accusation:

"If the SHOE FITS!!! TRAFFIC WEST was copied by Jay and there is NO QUESTION about that. But I have never made a public issue about it. Just you folks."

(in case that post is edited)

Jay is an innovator, and a gentleman. He has the respect of most in the community, except for certain self-centered individuals who would cast aspersions on his great event and ideas.

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

Come on guys!

In light of all these other threads:
http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?t=92097
http://domainpost.com/showthread.php?t=557
http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?t=69498&highlight=grudge+list

Do you guys REALLY believe that Rick and Howard are the kind of guys who would deliberately try to knock the legs out from under another conference which they viewed as competition!?

Come, come!

 

[jberryhill]

John ...how dare you throw facts out into the discussions, it ruins the BS that some are trying to spew.

Oh good golly... There are obviously people with strong feelings about one another, and various personal axes to grind. Whatever... From where I sit, it looks like two different audiences with different agendas. I don't know what protectible elements of organizing a conference can be "copied". I've been to technical conferences, legal conferences, trade shows, etc. - they all look about the same to me structurally. Pulling some people out of the ICANN orbit into a business conference is a really good idea, and I'm glad to see that overlap in Domain Roundtable. Getting domainers focused on critical business issues like hi-jacking and dealing with the changes in the PPC business coming about through some of the 800 pound gorillas on the block is also a good idea.

I really don't know of any business whose legal track record says anything other than "you win some, you lose some". I made $50 on a horse yesterday, in accordance with my prediction posted in another forum here. If I hadn't made that $50, I wouldn't have a personal grudge against the horse, and anyone would have been able to laugh at me in that forum. Big deal. Everyone who has never made a business decision that didn't work out, raise your hand....

 

[GeorgeK]

I see Rick was browsing this thread. But, instead of replying, he looks to be "private messaging":

http://www.loffs.com/images/rick_pm.gif
http://www.dnforum.com/online.php?sort=username&order=asc&pp=40&page=3

Let us hope that he's not begging the mods to delete this thread, where FACTS are being used to counter the negative aspersions towards Domain Roundtable, a PAYING SPONSOR of DNForum.com (see the front page ad), suggesting they are copy cats.

See the board's position on censorship at:
http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?t=83401

Where this cropped up when *FACTS* were being used to discuss the PPC abuses by Porno.com (and that thread continues to have not been restored to public view).

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

See the board's position on censorship at:
http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?t=83401

Where this cropped up when *FACTS* were being used to discuss the PPC abuses by Porno.com (and that thread continues to have not been restored to public view).

As I recall, that referenced deleted thread alleged CLICK FRAUD --isn't that correct?

 

[GeorgeK]

Threads haven't been deleted on other forums, regarding porno.com. A lady at Quicken Home Loans was unimpressed that their company was sandwiched between "gang bang" and "gay studs".

Porno.com is back to Fabulous PPC, where there are no further issues.

 

[Domagon]

I've found over the years folks who use the word "FACT" a bunch of times in their posts/discussion, emphasizing capitals nevertheless, without offering specifics, are generally full of it ...

My agenda is quite simple ... getting the truth - helps me know who and what to avoid; who to trust.

And while one-offs may be overlooked, from what I've read and links posted here by DaddyHalbucks and some PMs I received today, there's a disturbing pattern ...

To be clear, TRAFFIC may still be a worthwhile conference to attend, but one should, in my opinion, be very wary doing any business deals, etc with any of the principals of the TRAFFIC conference; questionable motives of some of the speakers, etc there.

Porno.com - interesting ... I won't get into that one, but illustrates that if one appears to have ethic issues, that may be just the tip of the iceburg; watch out!

Ron

 

[Fearless]

My favorite; I'm not going to either, but if I was, I'd go to ...

If I were going, I would go to Domain Roundtable. :cheeky:

I'm headed out on a 3 week European vacation a couple of days after it's over.
I can't take that much travelling. I'm normally a hermit.
I hope Domain Roundtable is a huge success and there is a Domain Roundtable II.

 

[NameYourself]

Domain Roundtable for me. Although I would probably learn more from the business side of things from TRAFFIC I'm hoping to get most of that done through the networking events after the roundtable discussions. This thread has really brought to light some of the motivations behind each show though. Frankly, I'd rather see my payments going to the Tsunami Relief fund. I'm sure Rick has some good plans too, but you can't argue against a good-hearted event that makes $0 profit. I say Roundtable now and TRAFFIC when it's in Delray in several months.. just do the same people, it is the best way around the date conflict.. and this way you can still attend both this year, so long as another one doesn't pop up in October

OH YEAH.. the biggest thing! Let's not let this divide the domain community. Let's put this whole thing to rest now and move on with the shows.

 

[GeorgeK]

Here's a simple question for Rick, and I'll use small words for his benefit:

Yes or no, did a Domain Name Conference take place in NYC in 2002, approximately 2 years before TRAFFIC?

http://web.archive.org/web/20021017070615/http://domainnameconference.com/index.html

Gain some credibility, by answering that question.

Then, regain some respect, by retracting your false assertions against Jay, and apologizing to him for your absurd accusations. You owe HIM the apology, not the other way around.

 

[shepherd2]

GeorgeK, what is it with you lately? I wasn't there when you got kicked off the board but is that really a reason to go on all boards the way you do? I can udnerstand (not really but anyways) the other lowlives here going on their hate campaign but it is not like you.
And for the other scums, you know who you are. You were never worth my time replying to you and you still are not.
Rick, Howard, take a step back. You are discussing things with the lowest kind of worms god ever put on earth. Why??
You guys put one hell of a show at traffic 2004, proved yourselves time and again, and you still think you need to explain yourselves to those few idiots who for some odd reason were not yet kicked out of here?
And as far as DomainRoundwhatever, don't forget it was Jay who came to traffic 2004, took ideas from ther, and ran to do his own. If someone is a copycat, no need to look further.
See you back on our board. I feel dirty in this place.

 

[GeorgeK]

You surely were there when I was banned, Shepherd. If you forgot, email me. Irregardless of that, I've never spoken a false thing about Rick, and he knows it. Everyone saw what porno.com was doing. Everyone saw Rick's case against Slavik. Everyone can verify Rick's UDRP losses, and compare them with his statements about "cybersquatters". Everyone can verify whether DirtyJokes.com was part of the men.com deal or not.

And Jay's no copycat. Notice how it was Traffic West that copied the idea of donating some proceeds of the conference to a cause, AFTER Jay decided to make it non-profit, for tsunami relief.

 

[acronym007]

I personally support both. I know there maybe some issues people have with other people or what have you, but the continued success of all Domain related events are great for "our" industry. I don't know Rick, even if Rick was stirring some things around, it would make me happy. Let's bring Domains to the forefront and get some recognition for them. I'm fairly new to the industry but I'm a huge fan. I think we all should support both conferences and hopefully in future it would be best served if they could chose different dates so we don't have to chose between the two. I cannot attend either but I think everyone will benefit that attends EITHER ONE. It's all information, networking, and growing the industry. This is good folks, two domain conferences is good, maybe there will be 4 next year, and 8 the next and soon, who knows. It has to start somewhere and while I do not know Rick nor will I say anything good or bad about him, I will say this, he has contributed something to this industry. When I got into the business, his name was one of the first I researched to understand what domain names was about. So some may not like his style but he's a part of us. Some people handle success differently than others, I'm not a millionaire yet so you'll have to wait and see how I handle it. I consider us all a team to bring about a collective benefit to the industry, let's work together and be constructive. My .02, for what's it's worth. Now, all of you go hug your mom's, its mother day!!!!! LOL

 

[bigowl]

It's funny how when a person is on top of his/her industry/field, there will always be those detractors who believe they should be on top instead, whether they are qualified or not. They need to earn that right and Rick certainly has. So I say to Rick, you must be doing something right if you have your detractors because that's part of the territory. You will never make everyone happy! Just shrug them off and answer to those who have the common sense to move this industry in the right direction.

For years, there has only been one name that is synonymous with this industry so if it wasn't for Rick Schwartz, this industry would be still in the dark ages. He has and still does everything possible to bring this industry to the forefront like it suddenly has now. Yes, he has made mistakes just like us all but his detractors only dwell on his and pretend they haven't made any themselves. So for those in this industry, no matter if you love him or not, we owe him a lot of gratitude but beware, his detractors will live on despite whatever good he does. Domainers that have common sense will see through all the bull and take the right road.

I'm a member of Rick's forum so I'm quite familiar with all that's going on there. After the October show in Delray, one of the first topics of discussion was whether we should have only one show per year or several. A few of us suggested that we should have a least 2 shows with one show somewhere in between the October shows. If any other members of Rick's forum want to verify this, they can check the time stamps sometime in November or December on this. Anyway, we pretty much decided to do a show sometime in the spring. Rick and Howard were already working on a venue when we found out about the Roundtable event.

So what is interesting, since Jay was a member of our forum, he had to have seen our discussion about the that topic so you would think that since Rick had such a successful show and was pretty much on top as domain conferences go, you would think that Jay would have contacted Rick to coordinate things but as far as I know, he didn't. There is nothing wrong with competition but I would say that it is Jay who has decided to compete with Rick rather than the other way around.

Don't get me wrong, I like Jay and met him in Delray. I also met him and Jothan in Seattle two months back and think they are two very nice guys. This is a very small industry with HUGE potential and influence on the world so the last thing I want to see is for us to get splintered. It will work against us so I hope that after the two conferences are over, the two sides will work with each other.

Beware of the naysayers because they will steer you wrong every time! You have to make sure that voice you hear isn't really that little devil on your shoulder trying to cause you to make the wrong decision. :cheeky:

 

[GeorgeK]

Was taking Slavik to UDRP a step "in the right direction" for the industry, BigOwl? Rick ignores valid criticisms at risk to his own credibility. You admit "he's made mistakes", yet Rick never seems to admit to or correct them.

It's been hours and hours, yet Rick won't even acknowledge that there was a domain conference 2 YEARS before TRAFFIC. A basic historical fact, and he won't acknowledge it, lest it destroy his fantasy that he originated domain conferences.

I think Rick somehow expects that anyone who wants to do a conference somehow needs to ask him for permission, given how he dared to call DomainRoundtable a "copy cat". How dare Jay run a conference! How dare Jay tread on any territory that "The King" deems his! How audacious!

 

[bigowl]

It's been hours and hours, yet Rick won't even acknowledge that there was a domain conference 2 YEARS before TRAFFIC. A basic historical fact, and he won't acknowledge it, lest it destroy his fantasy that he originated domain conferences.

I think Rick somehow expects that anyone who wants to do a conference somehow needs to ask him for permission, given how he dared to call DomainRoundtable a "copy cat". How dare Jay run a conference! How dare Jay tread on any territory that "The King" deems his! How audacious!

George, why do you seem so spiteful? What difference does it make if Rick answers your irrelevant question or not? He never said that he invented domain conferences so why make an issue out of it? So what if there was one 2 years ago! No, no one needs to get permission from Rick but since we are in an industry where there isn't that many major players in the conference arena, wouldn't you think it would make sense to coordinate with Rick if you thought he might have a second conference planned or was in the talking stage? Especially since Jay has made an issue of this after the fact?

 

[Cash Is King]

George

Your rumor, innuendo and personal agenda is comical. I guess holding grudges forever is the way to go these days, as you show. You got banned from a forum... so what! All I can say is welcome to the land of the big boys.

 

[GeorgeK]

It makes no difference to my life if he answers or not -- his silence already speaks volumes to others who are watching. arty:

Jay announced his conference first. TRAFFIC's website was showing conferences in October 2005 and even October 2006! You'd think that if there was a conference in May 2005, it would have had a higher priority or been hinted at somewhere, rather than a conference in 2006. This was pointed out in post #52 in this thread.

"So what if there was one 2 years ago"? Well, you have Howard Neu (post #27) suggesting "The entire concept being utilized by Domain Roundtable originated at T.R.A.F.F.I.C. 2004." Without the historical context, folks might have taken Howard's statement as gospel, instead of spin.

---
lol ClassicNames. Was voyuer.com's UDRP a "rumour"? I guess I made that one up.....like I invented a conference in 2002, and made up all ther other facts.

It's funny, as both DNPowerful and Namebox (search this forum for old threads) made peace with me. I don't hold a grudge. We've exchange pleasant emails, phonecalls, etc.

It's those who can't admit when they're wrong that are hanging on to something. arty: Calling Jay's innovative conference a "copy cat" was wrong, and he deserves better. I'm willing to stand up and be counted on this issue, and didn't even post in this thread until you know who spouted his garbage about it.

 

[ParkQuick.com]

The biggest problem that I have with the direction that this thread has taken is that it has gotten way off-topic at times. Why bring in other things you don't like about Rick? Why bring in the recent Voyeur decision (or however you spell it or misspell it)?

Obviously there are a lot of feelings involved, but much of this has no direct bearing on the issue of the two upcoming conferences. I understand that it may speak to ethics and character, etc., but rehashing old grudges isn't constructive for anyone. We can certainly learn from the past in order not to repeat past mistakes, but at some point we need to let it go, I think.

What can we learn from this? Maybe the organizers of future conferences can learn to schedule them on different dates! Both May conferences are weaker because people can't be in two places at once (including speakers and panelists).

I'd like to propose that TRAFFIC continue to hold their invitation-only fall event and leave the spring to Domain Roundtable - if they survive to hold an event every year. At the very least there should be a gentleman's agreement not to hold the spring events on the same dates in the future. We'll all benefit from such cooperation.

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

The biggest problem that I have with the direction that this thread has taken is that it has gotten way off-topic at times. Why bring in other things you don't like about Rick? Why bring in the recent Voyeur decision (or however you spell it or misspell it)?

Obviously there are a lot of feelings involved, but much of this has no direct bearing on the issue of the two upcoming conferences. I understand that it may speak to ethics and character, etc., but rehashing old grudges isn't constructive for anyone. We can certainly learn from the past in order not to repeat past mistakes, but at some point we need to let it go, I think.

What can we learn from this? Maybe the organizers of future conferences can learn to schedule them on different dates! Both May conferences are weaker because people can't be in two places at once (including speakers and panelists).

I'd like to propose that TRAFFIC continue to hold their invitation-only fall event and leave the spring to Domain Roundtable - if they survive to hold an event every year. At the very least there should be a gentleman's agreement not to hold the spring events on the same dates in the future. We'll all benefit from such cooperation.

The VOYUER.COM UDRP isn't an old grudge. It is brand new NEWS. The decision was just announced days ago!

The only "old grudge" I am aware of is the TRAFFIC policy to exclude people based on old grudges. This was posted on their own website. After getting flak, they took that down, and instead used the euphemistic "invitation only" which may just be a sugar coating on the same old road apple policy.

"Conferences are weaker because people can't be two places at once" --maybe this was the point.

"there should be a gentleman's agreement" --requires gentlemen.